empty stadiums throughout the SPL

I get that as it gives an illusion that the game is thriving and busy stadiums. It doesn't deal with the issue though that the authorities really need to be embarrassed into dealing with.

100% mate. Needs far more than that, but at least it would be a starting point. The SPFL seem happy with the situation.
 
Valid point mate but its ridiculous that two clubs in Dundee play in two separate stadiums next to each other would make sense to build one stadium and both clubs to play out the one stadium away from Tannadice and Dens .Happens in Italy .
Along the north side of the Forth from Alloa all the way up to Methil we have Alloa ,Dunfermline , Cowdenbeath , Raith Rovers ,East Fife , throw in St Johnston , Forfar, Brechin,Stenhousemuir, Arbroath ,and the two Dundee clubs all with a population catchment of fans smaller than Glasgow. Surely some of these clubs can amalgamate similar to what Inverness done
Total restructure is surely the only way forward .Two leagues of 16 with relegation and a pyramid system .Something has to change Jimbear restructure league , one governing body must be the way forward . At least get a think tank of football minded people to put recommendations to a totally new governing body to get those stands filled

The "too many clubs" argument has gone on for years but a lot of the clubs concerned in small towns throughout Scotland are a big part of their local communities. When those clubs are doing well their attendances increase above the hard core who support them through thick and thin. A lot of those supporters would never dream of going to support any other clubs. The structure argument is valid. I never thought there was a problem with the old two league system.
 
Don't understand why the Saints don't give us the far side and at least one end. Must cost them a fortune, not to mention the poor image for tv.

Ah well, it's their loss, we usually get the three points anyway.
Looked about just over 1000 home fans in that stand yesterday.
 
See the 4 Angus clubs and the 2 Dundee clubs all being within a fairly small catchment area, shouldn't there maybe just be the 2 bigger teams? Thus Dundee and Forfar could then thrive and the 4 diddy clubs could fùck off to the juniors
 
Which is absolutely nuts.

What I've always thought about the SPFL is that they are so caught up in this 'sectarianism' shite that they are almost scared to promote the football. In the run up to the derbies and bigger matches it should be coverage everywhere, massive build up etc. It's one of the biggest matches in the world and they do their best to downplay it and almost hide it away. They have a product in three decent city derbies yet do nothing to promote it.

They would rather empty stands if it meant it gave them and the cops an east life.
 
What I've always thought about the SPFL is that they are so caught up in this 'sectarianism' shite that they are almost scared to promote the football. In the run up to the derbies and bigger matches it should be coverage everywhere, massive build up etc. It's one of the biggest matches in the world and they do their best to downplay it and almost hide it away. They have a product in three decent city derbies yet do nothing to promote it.

They would rather empty stands if it meant it gave them and the cops an east life.

Agreed. A long while back they used to have 'derby day' where as many were played in the top flight as possible: Rangers v Celtic, Dundee United v Dundee, Hibs v Hearts etc. which gained interest, now they don't appear to want to big anything up. (I know that's just a small example)

Someone made the valid point of a better share of money coming into the game here which would involve collaborative working from all clubs but would the big earners buy into that? Remains to be seen.

Also, the 10k(?) all seater rule was a farce as well.............and don't get me started on Jean Marc Bosman.
 
The "too many clubs" argument has gone on for years but a lot of the clubs concerned in small towns throughout Scotland are a big part of their local communities. When those clubs are doing well their attendances increase above the hard core who support them through thick and thin. A lot of those supporters would never dream of going to support any other clubs. The structure argument is valid. I never thought there was a problem with the old two league system.
Not wanting the so called smaller clubs to totally disappear ,we should know better than most of the impact someone trying to kill of clubs generations of family history ,but they should be playing at a level where they can compete at Alloa and the like would play in a conference type league with the chance of reaching the second division through playoffs with other geographical conference leagues . This would be a long term plan obviously.
We should concentrate on one organisation running all of football as a matter of priority we should get rid of the days of small clubs like Alloa having huge influence on how the top teams conduct their business .
BTW not picking on Alloa specifically
 
Overpriced tickets
Over the top stewarding and policing
Terrible football from the majority
Restrictions on alcohol
No pyramid structure
Playing the same teams 4 times a season

It's no wonder a lot of fans don't bother their arse. SPFL/SFA could do so much to get the fans back but they seem to be happy with the empty stadiums as they never do anything to change it.

We definitely don’t need a pyramid structure, there are too many clubs in Scotland as it is but it’s certainly correct to say there’s things that could be done to make the product better which aren’t being looked at or considered and as there has been long standing issues and things don’t change you can only assume the powers that be prefer things to stay as they are.
 
We definitely don’t need a pyramid structure, there are too many clubs in Scotland as it is but it’s certainly correct to say there’s things that could be done to make the product better which aren’t being looked at or considered and as there has been long standing issues and things don’t change you can only assume the powers that be prefer things to stay as they are.

Why should clubs be able to finish bottom of a league and have no repercussion? It was totally ridiculous that East Stirling for example could finish bottom for years without anything ever happening. All it done was make the bottom of that league totally pointless as it never really mattered if you came last.

Same with Fort William now in the Highland League, finish bottom year after year but still keep their place in the division. Totally pointless.
 
Why should clubs be able to finish bottom of a league and have no repercussion? It was totally ridiculous that East Stirling for example could finish bottom for years without anything ever happening. All it done was make the bottom of that league totally pointless as it never really mattered if you came last.

Same with Fort William now in the Highland League, finish bottom year after year but still keep their place in the division. Totally pointless.

Correct look at it on the flip side, Cove Rangers prompted via the playoff last season and are flying this year in League Two.

A pyramid system (a real one - not the half arsed attempt we have at the moment) allows all clubs to find their real level.
 
Have heard this banded about but not sure it is accurate and cant find the stats to back it up - I would suggest that a fair percentage of our (and them) come from Ireland and England - so its a kind of misleading stat. What is more interesting is the utilisation figures - that is what percentage of seats are occupied as a factor of those available & apart from us & them then its very low - I only caught a wee bit of sprtscene last night but the Livi game looked like there was zero fans in two of the stands

There’s statistics on Twitter that are quite reliable that work out all the leagues.

We are the best per population, and have the 6th or 7th highest average attendance as well.
 
Absolutely, it's the elephant in the room.

How many people slating St Johnstone's home support are local to Perth?

I'm obviously not slating people for supporting Rangers but it is part of the reason why other SPL supports are so small.

Football is a territitorial game in most of the world. Clubs came from Communities. Simple fact, and it is why they have survived for 100+ years, and will continue to. To suggest we eradicate those is big club arrogance. If 400 want to turn up to see Montrose, or 4000 Ross County, that is fine by me.

What infuriates me is that Scottish Football is the only entertainment industry globally that chooses to actively limit customer attendance. Think about that. All the crap on this thread about income redistribution, and yet clubs choose 4 times per year to deny willing paying customers from buying tickets for empty seats. Where else does that happen. Would these same Chairmen turn you away from the businesses they built their wealth in if you wanted to buy from them and had the cash? Totally and utterly assinine.
 
The SPFL/SFA should be taking control of this and giving guidance and instruction to clubs in order to improve the image and saleability of our game.

Empty stands look shit and create a poor atmosphere thus reducing the price broadcasters are willing to pay.

Ita glaringly obvious what's needed to overhaul the overall image of the game and increase the income of all teams via broadcast deals yet the powers that be seem entirely uninterested in changing it.
Both bodies are not fit for purpose,and not just because the way Rangers are treated,but what do they do to earn their wages,if anything we're in decline and if it wasn't for the old firm, we'd be non league status. Shocking to think,when you think of where we were
 
Bad example because they actually fill a higher % their wee purpose built stadium than the other diddy teams. That's what happens when you can build what you need rather than being forced to build one that has more spaces than you have supporters.
Okay, didn’t realise that, thank you. But I think we agree, the stadiums they build are too big to be filled. Literally not enough people to fill them.
 
Folk from across Scotland will want to support us or them. They'll have a passing interest in their local team but that's it.

The debate of club mergers is wank and will/should never happen, IMO.

Agree with u there. How could u expect a Dundee or a Dundee Utd fan for example just stop supporting their club and start supporting a new one with their biggest rivals. Absolute bullshit
 
Could have fitted that St Johnstone crowd into 1 or 2 sections ffs! Big fecking empty stand when we have about 14k on the away scheme!
 
I fully understand clubs not selling out their entire stadium - for almost any reason

But what I find hypocritical is if they contrive to limit their attendances to the detrement of their earning power - yet still complaining about an even split of TV revenues for example

Empty seats do nothing for the game whatever way you look at it

If clubs want to limit the mumbers of opposition fans but have an emptier stadium as a result - I'd have a lot more respect for them if they at least gave reduced or free tickets to school kids, oap's, disabled or other concessions etc. rather than simply create large gaps

If they are genuinely unable to deal with effective segregation - then their grounds need reviewed & authorities issuing safety & / or security clearance need to help with their problems where possible

But if it isn't possible their grounds should have their licenses revoked as unfit for purpose

May seem a bit harsh but this should be reality imo
 
I live in Perth and can remember getting 1 full stand behind goals, 1 stand along the pitch and majority of the other behind the goals as a mixed family stand. Don't know when that changed!

Had that been the case yesterday then it would have left only empty seats in the main stand with the cameras.
was laughing at my neighbour yesterday when he was trying to tell me that all the bigotry and thuggish behavior from the rangers fans keeps the home support away!!!
 
Overpriced tickets
Over the top stewarding and policing
Terrible football from the majority
Restrictions on alcohol
No pyramid structure
Playing the same teams 4 times a season

It's no wonder a lot of fans don't bother their arse. SPFL/SFA could do so much to get the fans back but they seem to be happy with the empty stadiums as they never do anything to change it.
 
There is a pyramid system East Stirling went out two seasons ago and Berwick Rangers went out last season with Edinburgh City came in and Cove Rangers came in last season , Its only the Juniors that didn't want in System as there a lowland and highland leagues the division 2 team drops down through playoff
 
Absolute insanity the amount of teams in Scotland , if England was to follow our "football model " there would be 400 league teams in England . Add in the fact that it costs £15 to watch the likes of East Fife v Dumbarton and it's really not hard to see how the game is dying a slow death .
 
Absolute insanity the amount of teams in Scotland , if England was to follow our "football model " there would be 400 league teams in England . Add in the fact that it costs £15 to watch the likes of East Fife v Dumbarton and it's really not hard to see how the game is dying a slow death .

It costs £15 to watch East Fife v Dumbarton because even part time clubs have costs to pay. If folk don't go along to support their local club then those who do are left picking up the costs.

There has never been a halcyon era where clubs across the country have had sell out crowds but back in those days clubs had far more power with regards to player contracts and costs were relatively well controlled. Thats not the case in the modern era. Even in the lower leagues players can demand money that doesnt match their ability. Clubs pay it because if they dont then a rival will.

The Scottish public are no longer in love with football. Rangers and Celtic attendances skew things. Add in the folk who support an old firm club but don't go to games. In the past there was a tradition of folk still following their local team. That's long gone. The average football fan is older now than 33 years ago when I started going to games and even back then it was a minority of kids who went to games. The Scottish public has simply stopped seeing football as something that you experience live on a Saturday afternoon.

The critical thing for Scottish football is to get more people through the gates. More people going to games on a Saturday. More people playing football. More people actually caring about football enough to become involved. Lower league football might not be of the same standard as what you'll see on TV on a Saturday night but TV has warped expectations beyond all reality. Newcastle v Brighton was a shite game. East Fife v Dumbarton had 4 goals and was a proper battling game where either side could have taken all 3 points. The EPL game is clearly more technical. The East Fife v Dumbarton game was the better spectacle and offered more of a competition. It's TV that has dictated that the only football worth bothering with is top flight football that's often high on technique but low on drama.

The biggest barrier to the likes of East Fife, Dumbarton, Airdrie etc getting bigger crowds is apathy. Local families or kids who may well never experience football as a live spectacle. There's a generation of kids growing up who think that football is something you play in your bedroom on a games console or watch on TV. The only thing that will improve Scottish football for everybody is changing that attitude and getting people along to experience football live and in person. Experience the matchday atmosphere. Experience meeting up with your mates before the game. Experience cheering for your team. Experience celebrating or commiserating with your mates in the crowd. Experience the anticipation building during the week as you look forward to doing it all again.

Get people engaged with football, playing football and going to football games and you'll improve Scottish football because you'll have a population who actually cares about it. Its so rare for folk to go to games these days that any football fan - whether its one of the 50,000+ at Ibrox on a Saturday or the couple of hundred at a League Two or top level junior game - deserves a pat on the back because without them the game in Scotland is as good as dead.
 
Valid point mate but its ridiculous that two clubs in Dundee play in two separate stadiums next to each other would make sense to build one stadium and both clubs to play out the one stadium away from Tannadice and Dens .Happens in Italy .
Along the north side of the Forth from Alloa all the way up to Methil we have Alloa ,Dunfermline , Cowdenbeath , Raith Rovers ,East Fife , throw in St Johnston , Forfar, Brechin,Stenhousemuir, Arbroath ,and the two Dundee clubs all with a population catchment of fans smaller than Glasgow. Surely some of these clubs can amalgamate similar to what Inverness done
Total restructure is surely the only way forward .Two leagues of 16 with relegation and a pyramid system .Something has to change Jimbear restructure league , one governing body must be the way forward . At least get a think tank of football minded people to put recommendations to a totally new governing body to get those stands filled

Inverness Caley Thistle aren't liked in Inverness. A lot of people refuse to accept the merger of the 2 previous clubs. They don't get anything like the support they should.

Merging teams doesnt work. All you achieve is alienating the local area and driving fans away from football. Caley Thistle are perfect proof of that. They struggle to get crowds above 3000 on a regular basis in an area with only 2 professional teams. Ross County are far more popular of the 2 because they're not a bastardised merged club.
 
Can't understand why St Johnstone had so many empty seats today. Crowd was something like 6251. I did a quick check on wikipedia earlier and mcdairmid holds about 4000 more than that. That's a lot of revenue to lose and while they may not have sold every one of those empty seats to bears, it would surely have been a lot closer to capacity than what it actually was. When you add in lost potential for sales of programmes, food, drinks, etc, it adds up to significant losses and missed opportunity for St Johnstone today. If that happens, say, 3 times a season (I'm assuming that they host either us or the tramps twice a season) that's a load of dough that would surely be useful to clubs like these. Would it be that difficult to relocate saints supporters into 1 or 2 areas, so that their club could maximize revenue potential?

Easy. The people of Perth and the surrounding towns and villages just don't like St Johnstone. They don't have any interest in going along to their local team.

Difficulty is in challenging that and encouraging people to make Saturday afternoon football part of their life.
 
Too many teams. Low skill level. Overpriced product. No appetite to improve. No leadership. Poor officiating. Poor league structure. I could continue but whats the point lol.

Too many teams - Sweden's football set up isnt smaller than ours.
Low skill level - We've raised a generation of football fans who prefer dour, technical football over competitive football. If it isnt highly structured and tippy tappy then modern fans don't want to know. We value tactics and technique over goals and a genuine battle.
Price - reflects the costs of running a team. Wages in league 1 and league 2 can be as much as £500 per week. If clubs don't pay then a rival will. Running a club costs money. Fewer punters through the turnstiles means those who do go end up paying more.
Appetite to improve - improve what? Match day experience? Player technique? Is it any easier to sell Scottish football to the public if games are highly technical but still end up as dull 0-0 draws? What do you actually want to improve about the game in Scotland?
Officiating - Fans would hate to have a game refereed properly. Refs are human and make mistakes. No fan complains about the decisions given incorrectly that favour their team.
League structure - We have 5 tiers in Scottish football if you include the Highland/Lowland leagues. That's expanding to 6 if enough junior sides step up. The league structure is changing. What changes do fans want? 2 divisions of 20? Divisions of 18? Regional leagues from tier 3 down? It's crazy that last season the biggest journey in Scottish football was Elgin to Berwick, but what do folk want as an alternative?

Whats the point of going on? Because if enough people don't see the point then football in Scotland dies of apathy.
 
Inverness Caley Thistle aren't liked in Inverness. A lot of people refuse to accept the merger of the 2 previous clubs. They don't get anything like the support they should.

Merging teams doesnt work. All you achieve is alienating the local area and driving fans away from football. Caley Thistle are perfect proof of that. They struggle to get crowds above 3000 on a regular basis in an area with only 2 professional teams. Ross County are far more popular of the 2 because they're not a bastardised merged club.

I’m too young for the merger but was it not only done through both clubs agreeing to it?

Inverness kind of sums Scottish football up in a way. A one team city, the biggest club in the highlands. Yet when Rangers or Celtic go there there’s nothing but apathy from the home fans. They should have a real, young vibrant support wanting to challenge the bigger sides. Yet it’s four men and a dug at the game with the only atmosphere coming from the away fans. At least Aberdeen try to make it a bit intimidating and have a go.
 
Too many teams - Sweden's football set up isnt smaller than ours.
Low skill level - We've raised a generation of football fans who prefer dour, technical football over competitive football. If it isnt highly structured and tippy tappy then modern fans don't want to know. We value tactics and technique over goals and a genuine battle.
Price - reflects the costs of running a team. Wages in league 1 and league 2 can be as much as £500 per week. If clubs don't pay then a rival will. Running a club costs money. Fewer punters through the turnstiles means those who do go end up paying more.
Appetite to improve - improve what? Match day experience? Player technique? Is it any easier to sell Scottish football to the public if games are highly technical but still end up as dull 0-0 draws? What do you actually want to improve about the game in Scotland?
Officiating - Fans would hate to have a game refereed properly. Refs are human and make mistakes. No fan complains about the decisions given incorrectly that favour their team.
League structure - We have 5 tiers in Scottish football if you include the Highland/Lowland leagues. That's expanding to 6 if enough junior sides step up. The league structure is changing. What changes do fans want? 2 divisions of 20? Divisions of 18? Regional leagues from tier 3 down? It's crazy that last season the biggest journey in Scottish football was Elgin to Berwick, but what do folk want as an alternative?

Whats the point of going on? Because if enough people don't see the point then football in Scotland dies of apathy.

Totally disagree with the tactics thing. Scotland would be far better if we had more technical coaches and less that considered strength and height more important than passing and skill.
 
I’m too young for the merger but was it not only done through both clubs agreeing to it?

Inverness kind of sums Scottish football up in a way. A one team city, the biggest club in the highlands. Yet when Rangers or Celtic go there there’s nothing but apathy from the home fans. They should have a real, young vibrant support wanting to challenge the bigger sides. Yet it’s four men and a dug at the game with the only atmosphere coming from the away fans. At least Aberdeen try to make it a bit intimidating and have a go.

It doesnt matter if the clubs agreed to it. The fans rejected it. Caley Thistle's crowds have shrunk since the initial curiosity wore off. Fans tend not to follow merged teams unless it's in the very lowest levels of English football.
 
Totally disagree with the tactics thing. Scotland would be far better if we had more technical coaches and less that considered strength and height more important than passing and skill.

We already have that in pro youth. We concentrate on tactics and technique.

That doesnt make a technically proficient 0-0 draw any more entertaining as a spectacle than a high scoring 4-3 win.

I also follow hockey. I've never heard anybody within UK hockey - officials or fans - say that UK hockey isn't worth bothering with because it isnt as highly skilled as the NHL or KHL. They sell the league on match experience, competition and entertainment.
 
We already have that in pro youth. We concentrate on tactics and technique.

That doesnt make a technically proficient 0-0 draw any more entertaining as a spectacle than a high scoring 4-3 win.

It doesn’t but it makes better players. I’d rather watch players with better ability than a school level 10-6 game.
 
It doesn’t but it makes better players. I’d rather watch players with better ability than a school level 10-6 game.

So why bother watching Scottish football at all? If it's all about the technical merits of a game and not about the competition then why not simply subscribe to pay TV and watch the likes of Newcastle v Brighton? Why bother following Scottish football at all? Or any sport that isnt the absolute top level of that game?
 
It costs £15 to watch East Fife v Dumbarton because even part time clubs have costs to pay. If folk don't go along to support their local club then those who do are left picking up the costs.

There has never been a halcyon era where clubs across the country have had sell out crowds but back in those days clubs had far more power with regards to player contracts and costs were relatively well controlled. Thats not the case in the modern era. Even in the lower leagues players can demand money that doesnt match their ability. Clubs pay it because if they dont then a rival will.

The Scottish public are no longer in love with football. Rangers and Celtic attendances skew things. Add in the folk who support an old firm club but don't go to games. In the past there was a tradition of folk still following their local team. That's long gone. The average football fan is older now than 33 years ago when I started going to games and even back then it was a minority of kids who went to games. The Scottish public has simply stopped seeing football as something that you experience live on a Saturday afternoon.

The critical thing for Scottish football is to get more people through the gates. More people going to games on a Saturday. More people playing football. More people actually caring about football enough to become involved. Lower league football might not be of the same standard as what you'll see on TV on a Saturday night but TV has warped expectations beyond all reality. Newcastle v Brighton was a shite game. East Fife v Dumbarton had 4 goals and was a proper battling game where either side could have taken all 3 points. The EPL game is clearly more technical. The East Fife v Dumbarton game was the better spectacle and offered more of a competition. It's TV that has dictated that the only football worth bothering with is top flight football that's often high on technique but low on drama.

The biggest barrier to the likes of East Fife, Dumbarton, Airdrie etc getting bigger crowds is apathy. Local families or kids who may well never experience football as a live spectacle. There's a generation of kids growing up who think that football is something you play in your bedroom on a games console or watch on TV. The only thing that will improve Scottish football for everybody is changing that attitude and getting people along to experience football live and in person. Experience the matchday atmosphere. Experience meeting up with your mates before the game. Experience cheering for your team. Experience celebrating or commiserating with your mates in the crowd. Experience the anticipation building during the week as you look forward to doing it all again.

Get people engaged with football, playing football and going to football games and you'll improve Scottish football because you'll have a population who actually cares about it. Its so rare for folk to go to games these days that any football fan - whether its one of the 50,000+ at Ibrox on a Saturday or the couple of hundred at a League Two or top level junior game - deserves a pat on the back because without them the game in Scotland is as good as dead.
spot on sir!
 
Lots of really good points on here and until 2012 this used to bother me.
Since then I say, f’ck them all, the national tranny’s and the governing body.
I only care about 1 team now and i
Can’t see that changing.
 
It would also help if the Scottish government through councils would stop selling off public parks for housing development .
 
made the mistake of watching Sportscene and my god the empty stadiums throughout the league makes me question the value of winning the SPL! what an embarrasment our top league is with half empty shitey grounds and plastic pitches. We need to get out of this backwater ASAP!

Sure I read that attendance per capita of people is one of the highest in Europe. We are a tiny country with two clubs who almost everyone supports , the rest will always struggle to fill stadiums.
 
I would love to see Rangers escaping Scotland in my lifetime.
I was watching Carrick vs Linfield last night and there seemed to be a good crowd despite the weather and despite the quality of the league.
I was thinking that it is a shame that they could not find their proper level in a UK league. And of course us too
 
Every game involving Rangers or Celtic should sell out.

No amount of reasoning can convince me empty seats can somehow benefit the home team.
 
There is a pyramid system East Stirling went out two seasons ago and Berwick Rangers went out last season with Edinburgh City came in and Cove Rangers came in last season , Its only the Juniors that didn't want in System as there a lowland and highland leagues the division 2 team drops down through playoff

Yeah mate but it's only recently been brought in, and is still a bit messed up. Sure a couple of years ago Cove got beat in the playoff and the rumour at the time was they wanted to stay in the Highland League rather than go up?

A lot of Juniors oppose it but should be brought in line and added in to the pyramid at some level. It's pointless having Junior teams that are better than some League 2 sides, Highland/Lowland sides. Everyone should find their level in the pyramid after a few years.
 
So why bother watching Scottish football at all? If it's all about the technical merits of a game and not about the competition then why not simply subscribe to pay TV and watch the likes of Newcastle v Brighton? Why bother following Scottish football at all? Or any sport that isnt the absolute top level of that game?

What are you talking about? Surely all players should be coached and want to reach the top level? Why should players in the poorer leagues not be coached to play better football? Our teams get routinely humiliated in Europe because countries that were well behind have managed to train players, coaches and have whole academies focused on getting their players better.
 
Inverness Caley Thistle aren't liked in Inverness. A lot of people refuse to accept the merger of the 2 previous clubs. They don't get anything like the support they should.

Merging teams doesnt work. All you achieve is alienating the local area and driving fans away from football. Caley Thistle are perfect proof of that. They struggle to get crowds above 3000 on a regular basis in an area with only 2 professional teams. Ross County are far more popular of the 2 because they're not a bastardised merged club.

To be fair, Inverness has a population less than Ibrox can hold, as do a lot of these types of teams like Kilmarnock, Falkirk, Motherwell etc. so I don't think we should be slating them for small crowds when they don't have the people there to start with. You say they don't get the support they should but how much more could they realistically get?

The actual percentage per population going to the games is probably more than Glaswegian Rangers supporters who go to Ibrox as well for example.

These are teams who play or who have have mostly played in our top league and they are basically small town teams. We can't expect them to be attracting much more.
 
The lack of a decent terrestrial TV package I think gives an image of bottom feeder, attention Aldi shoppers, to our league I reckon.
Not getting in to the issues we have with the BBC (or they have with us), a Saturday night at 10pm before MOTD broadcast with comprehensive highlights of that days games, with a bit of money spent on it, employing a decent host and pundits shouldn't be impossible to achieve. I argued that to someone I know who works in media and he told me I was wrong, that nowadays everything has to be packaged in 30 second videos that you can watch on your phone, but MOTD has worked forever using a more or less unchanged format - why couldn't we have similar.
 
I never quite understand why chairmen of the diddy clubs with the half empty grounds don’t simply drop their ticket prices to attract more punters.

There must be an optimum point where they’d make a bigger profit?
 
I never quite understand why chairmen of the diddy clubs with the half empty grounds don’t simply drop their ticket prices to attract more punters.

There must be an optimum point where they’d make a bigger profit?

Cost.

500 fans paying £15 a head brings in £7500. At £10 a head you'd need to find another 250 fans to turn up.

Is the cost of the ticket really the reason those 250 extra folk aren't going to their local team?

It isn't. Cost may be a factor but it isn't the only factor or even the most significant factor.
 
What are you talking about? Surely all players should be coached and want to reach the top level? Why should players in the poorer leagues not be coached to play better football? Our teams get routinely humiliated in Europe because countries that were well behind have managed to train players, coaches and have whole academies focused on getting their players better.

All players should want to be as good as they can be. Does that translate into European success? In the modern game that success is clustered on 3 or 4 leagues. The biggest teams in England, Spain, Germany and Italy are buying players at a young age. How much development is actually being done in Austria? Or Czech Republic? Or Poland? Or any other medium sized footballing nation? And does the training translate to successful clubs with healthy attendances?

There is a minimal number of players capable of developing to a high level. Do we simply write off everybody else because they don't fit into the narrow definition of the modern technical player? We'd have enough players for about half a dozen teams in the whole of the UK and could effectively close every other team.

If all that matters is technical skill then what's the point of 99% of clubs in world football?

Thankfully we have fans who actually care about the game. The problem is that we don't have enough of them.
 
All players should want to be as good as they can be. Does that translate into European success? In the modern game that success is clustered on 3 or 4 leagues. The biggest teams in England, Spain, Germany and Italy are buying players at a young age. How much development is actually being done in Austria? Or Czech Republic? Or Poland? Or any other medium sized footballing nation? And does the training translate to successful clubs with healthy attendances?

There is a minimal number of players capable of developing to a high level. Do we simply write off everybody else because they don't fit into the narrow definition of the modern technical player? We'd have enough players for about half a dozen teams in the whole of the UK and could effectively close every other team.

If all that matters is technical skill then what's the point of 99% of clubs in world football?

Thankfully we have fans who actually care about the game. The problem is that we don't have enough of them.


You are completely missing every point.

If you are only interested in football for massive scorelines maybe it's not for you. The 5-5 game against Hibs sums it up. Lots of goals, but absolutely no quality whatsoever. Two very poor sides with no understanding of tactics playing schoolboy style football.
 
i dont say this lightly but i feel that whether we win 55 or 555 titles anyone outside of Scotland would just be like - and????

Been banging this drum for a long time. This is why we need to keep the coefficient up and keep our product respectable.

Otherwise winning it is meaningless. Quite literally.
 
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