Celtic face threat of multimillion pound compensation claim(The Times)

Kinghornloyal said:
PENN state the actual body were fined by the National Collegiate Athletics Association. Not by a court of Law. They had 111 titles or trophies taken off them but that was overturned on appeal. 3 members of the committee were given months in jail. The majority was house arrest. So the actual University wasnt punished by Courts.They weren't hammered under sporting sanctions as such. The main culprit got a long jail sentence. Just like the accusers here have been jailed. Celtic themselves will be happy to pay little compensation and Celtic FC won't face any sanctions. Some past staff may, but that will be it..
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I'm aware of all that, but Rangers were punished by the governing bodies in a sporting sense, not the law courts. And CFC's crimes are on another level to Penn State's.

A proper investigation would most definitely show that serious crimes went unreported, and I'm pretty certain that several CFC officials, who have not been tried in a court of law, would be on very shaky ground.

I'm not sure why you're so keen to brush this off and dismiss the prospects of the club being punished. An independent investigation would open up a whole new can of worms. The issue is whether Scotland, the politicians and the governing bodies will ever do the right thing.
 
SilvaBear said:
I'm aware of all that, but Rangers were punished by the governing bodies in a sporting sense, not the law courts. And CFC's crimes are on another level to Penn State's.

A proper investigation would most definitely show that serious crimes went unreported, and I'm pretty certain that several CFC officials, who have not been tried in a court of law, would be on very shaky ground.

I'm not sure why you're so keen to brush this off and dismiss the prospects of the club being punished. An independent investigation would open up a whole new can of worms. The issue is whether Scotland, the politicians and the governing bodies will ever do the right thing.
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I'm brushing it off because the government and the SFA/SPFL have had their investigations. There will be zero rush by them to open them.back up again. Their result was to state there were paedos working at a variety of clubs including ours. They then set about trying to impose new rules regarding kids/youths. They weren't interested in actually trying to punish anyone. So I cannot see that happening.

I'd rather they were investigated and severely punished. We were punished due to the fact Craig Whyte failed to pay Tax and put us into administration. That's why we were dealt with in sporting terms.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
I'm brushing it off because the government and the SFA/SPFL have had their investigations. There will be zero rush by them to open them.back up again. Their result was to state there were paedos working at a variety of clubs including ours. They then set about trying to impose new rules regarding kids/youths. They weren't interested in actually trying to punish anyone. So I cannot see that happening.

I'd rather they were investigated and severely punished. We were punished due to the fact Craig Whyte failed to pay Tax and put us into administration. That's why we were dealt with in sporting terms.
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When did the government investigate? The omitted sporting and religious organisations from their enquiry.
 
TheGreatDane said:
When did the government investigate? The omitted sporting and religious organisations from their enquiry.
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OK mistake. The SFA had an investigation. The SNP have confirmed the government won't be holding an investigation into Scottish Football historical Abuse. I also can't see that changing even after the Celtic issue finishes.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
I'm brushing it off because the government and the SFA/SPFL have had their investigations. There will be zero rush by them to open them.back up again. Their result was to state there were paedos working at a variety of clubs including ours. They then set about trying to impose new rules regarding kids/youths. They weren't interested in actually trying to punish anyone. So I cannot see that happening.

I'd rather they were investigated and severely punished. We were punished due to the fact Craig Whyte failed to pay Tax and put us into administration. That's why we were dealt with in sporting terms.
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The SFA/SPFL "investigations" were more in-house cover-ups than investigations, and people should be demanding an independent investigation into CFC.

Had the governing bodies done their jobs, Craig Whyte would never had been involved with our club, and they were fully aware that he wasn't paying taxes, allowed it to continue.
We could have sold a couple of players and settled with HMRC, but we were royally fuk'd by the SFA/SPFL and HMRC. It was a coordinated attack when we were also being shafted by the spivs.
The sporting punishment was farcical in the circumstances.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
OK mistake. The SFA had an investigation. The SNP have confirmed the government won't be holding an investigation into Scottish Football historical Abuse. I also can't see that changing even after the Celtic issue finishes.
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The SFA investigation was a complete joke, written by a nonce and given to the main perpetrators for review and comment prior to publishing.

Several opposition MSPs have either called for one or backed a proper enquiry? The SNP are done and it’s only a matter of time until there is another party in power. It would seem a strange time to give up on a proper enquiry where lessons can be learned.
 
SilvaBear said:
The SFA/SPFL "investigations" were more in-house cover-ups than investigations, and people should be demanding an independent investigation into CFC.

Had the governing bodies done their jobs, Craig Whyte would never had been involved with our club, and they were fully aware that he wasn't paying taxes, allowed it to continue.
We could have sold a couple of players and settled with HMRC, but we were royally fuk'd by the SFA/SPFL and HMRC. It was a coordinated attack when we were also being shafted by the spivs.
The sporting punishment was farcical in the circumstances.
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We were put into admin after the window closed. We couldn't have sold anyone. Craig Whyte wasn't interested in paying anything. The plan was to strip us to pieces. He then got shafted by Green. However these were football matters and we got punished. Celtics issue is employed people breaking the law. The club isn't on a criminal charge so there won't be sanctions. The paedos have been getting jail time..
 
TheGreatDane said:
The SFA investigation was a complete joke, written by a nonce and given to the main perpetrators for review and comment prior to publishing.

Several opposition MSPs have either called for one or backed a proper enquiry? The SNP are done and it’s only a matter of time until there is another party in power. It would seem a strange time to give up on a proper enquiry where lessons can be learned.
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If a new Government decides that then so be it. However a different government will still be looking after themselves first and won't have any inclination to be spending millions of pounds on a public enquiry to punish them. Again in my opinion.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
We were put into admin after the window closed. We couldn't have sold anyone. Craig Whyte wasn't interested in paying anything. The plan was to strip us to pieces. He then got shafted by Green. However these were football matters and we got punished. Celtics issue is employed people breaking the law. The club isn't on a criminal charge so there won't be sanctions. The paedos have been getting jail time..
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But their enablers who were running CFC haven't, which is why people should be demanding a new, independent investigation. You appear to be happy to move on though. I'm not.
 
SilvaBear said:
But their enablers who were running CFC haven't, which is why people should be demanding a new, independent investigation. You appear to be happy to move on though. I'm not.
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Just cause I don't believe that the Club will ever be charged or sanctioned doesn't mean I'm happy why would it. It's how I believe the government or those in charge of Scottish football are run. There is zero appetite to punish Celtic.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
Just cause I don't believe that the Club will ever be charged or sanctioned doesn't mean I'm happy why would it. It's how I believe the government or those in charge of Scottish football are run. There is zero appetite to punish Celtic.
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Well there should be another nationwide campaign to have them investigated.

Make no mistake, were Rangers employees guilty of these crimes, they'd have tried to shut us down.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
I agree 100% but I don't see it happening. It would have been started years ago
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Did we not get told that any investigation would need to wait until the criminal courts process was concluded?

Well they've 8 or 9 convicted paedos now, and no investigation as to how and why that situation was allowed to continue for decades.
The Scottish people should be demanding a proper and independent investigation before all the bastards die off. Delaying all they can until this happens is clearly part of their game plan.
 
SilvaBear said:
Did we not get told that any investigation would need to wait until the criminal courts process was concluded?

Well they've 8 or 9 convicted paedos now, and no investigation as to how and why that situation was allowed to continue for decades.
The Scottish people should be demanding a proper and independent investigation before all the bastards die off. Delaying all they can until this happens is clearly part of their game plan.
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Who do the Scottish People make these demands to. Also who will listen. There is zero timescale on when Criminal proceedings will end cause more cases can be reported continually. This civil case isn't what's holding things up. There are zero criminal charges with it
 
Kinghornloyal said:
Who do the Scottish People make these demands to. Also who will listen. There is zero timescale on when Criminal proceedings will end cause more cases can be reported continually. This civil case isn't what's holding things up. There are zero criminal charges with it
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We need an MP or MSP to raise the issue again in govt, maybe on the back of a new petition demanding action. Wouldn't be too hard to get 100,000 signatures, or whatever it takes these days.
 
SilvaBear said:
We need an MP or MSP to raise the issue again in govt, maybe on the back of a new petition demanding action. Wouldn't be too hard to get 100,000 signatures, or whatever it takes these days.
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You would think it wouldn't be hard but even after the issue is raised its normally brushed over.
 
SilvaBear said:
The victims should be well compensated, but in most civilized countries, the club would also be fully investigated and held to account for their abhorrent behavior and failure to protect the children under their watch.

Look at Penn State over here in the US, they were absolutely hammered for a tiny fraction of the crimes committed by the CFC pedophile ring.

There may be more chance of this happening now, with Scotland's SHITE FM (and wannabe CFC CEO) abdicating and the SNP imploding. Hopefully a reformed Scottish parliament will carry out the long overdue independent investigation, and hold that vile club to account.

Rangers were sent to the 4th division and lost a full squad of players for nothing, for effectively using a legal tax avoidance scheme.

What's a suitable and equitable punishment for allowing a pedophile ring to operate under your watch for decades, not reporting these vile crimes against children, then re-employing known pedophiles?
That club should be shut down. They won't, but they should be, and would be in a decent and civilized country.
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Too many on here telling us that as long as the victims are compensated then that's all and good.

Making out that anyone who wants Celtic punished somehow doesn't care about the victims.

Wanting both things to happen is far from a bad thing.

If Celtic get away with their disgraceful behaviour of ignoring the victims pleas to the extent they actually re employed the perps which enabled them to commit further crimes against children then something is very wrong.

I know a few Celtic supporters who tell me I'm bad for bringing it up as it only traumatises the victims. Nothing to do with their club not wanting it to be aired in public.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
PENN state the actual body were fined by the National Collegiate Athletics Association. Not by a court of Law. They had 111 titles or trophies taken off them but that was overturned on appeal. 3 members of the committee were given months in jail. The majority was house arrest. So the actual University wasnt punished by Courts.They weren't hammered under sporting sanctions as such. The main culprit got a long jail sentence. Just like the accusers here have been jailed. Celtic themselves will be happy to pay little compensation and Celtic FC won't face any sanctions. Some past staff may, but that will be it..
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I think it was only the titles that were returned but I think the fines still stood. Do you know anything regarding the fines?
 
They should as a club be held responsible for the crimes committed by employees of their club,especially when they knew and brought them back into the club.that wasn't just negligence that was enabling .we all know this runs deeper than just celtic fc a lot of people are connected not just in Scotland but in the UK.
 
GourockBlue50 said:
I think it was only the titles that were returned but I think the fines still stood. Do you know anything regarding the fines?
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I looked but couldn't see if they were paid out. The difference here is this was all a criminal trial in relation to the main accused. However there were many many civil claims and.counter claims. Insurance involved etc etc. It looks like Penn State themselves accepted nearly $100m in payouts that were due but unknown how much they actually paid out.

Having read into it there are lots of similarities with Celtic to be honest as there were alleged witnesses to the accuseds conduct from other coaches who went further professionally into coaching but can't find whether anything was reported to the actuall University Bosses who started a cover up. It's a harrowing read to be honest. America is so different as over their it's all about money. Penn state has just carried on regardless. 3 bad years due to sanctions regarding scholarships but have continued winning as a team
 
ibroxbound said:
There was some dubiety about the Chairman of the SFA investigation.
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Oh guaranteed mate. The investigation would have been focusing on making sure there were coaches linked with us so they could play the card of its happened all over so do you all want investigated and in bother. They weren't interested in proving any cover up at Celtic. They just wanted to prove it is or was alleged at various clubs and let's move on to make things better.
 
They covered up child abuse for a sporting advantage,they should be punished and severely. Children were knowingly sexually abused to allow that bastardised club to win games of football, that needs corrected. The fundamental issue is that the body responsible in ensuring that the clubs standing is corrected is corrupted by the same club responsible. Some day they will face the repercussions for their vile actions.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
I'm brushing it off because the government and the SFA/SPFL have had their investigations. There will be zero rush by them to open them.back up again. Their result was to state there were paedos working at a variety of clubs including ours. They then set about trying to impose new rules regarding kids/youths. They weren't interested in actually trying to punish anyone. So I cannot see that happening.

I'd rather they were investigated and severely punished. We were punished due to the fact Craig Whyte failed to pay Tax and put us into administration. That's why we were dealt with in sporting terms.
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We were punished through sheer weight of numbers with a concerted and determined strategy to do so. That was the goal, and a serious effort by all involved ensured that's exactly what happened.

The question for those of us who understand perfectly the evil entity that CFC has become, is do we have the wherewithal to return the favour or are simply incapable.
 
Bluethruandthru said:
We were punished through sheer weight of numbers with a concerted and determined strategy to do so. That was the goal, and a serious effort by all involved ensured that's exactly what happened.

The question for those of us who understand perfectly the evil entity that CFC has become, is do we have the wherewithal to return the favour or are simply incapable.
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We were punished for not paying the wee tax case and going into admin. That was it. We, sorry Craig Whyte broke the league accountancy rules so they had the option to demote us. The other clubs voted for it.

When this civil case is over there is zero current recompense whereby the league can punish Celtic as the actual Club havnt broken the league rules. There were employees who have been paedos. The civil case won't hold Celtic criminally at fault and there is zero chance they will be kicked out the league. No teams would vote for that. Legally Celtic would blow that out the water.

That's how I see it. This is about Celtic paying the victims. With money. Not anything to do with the football results or honours.
 
SilvaBear said:
Did we not get told that any investigation would need to wait until the criminal courts process was concluded?

Well they've 8 or 9 convicted paedos now, and no investigation as to how and why that situation was allowed to continue for decades.
The Scottish people should be demanding a proper and independent investigation before all the bastards die off. Delaying all they can until this happens is clearly part of their game plan.
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9 were convicted SB.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
We were punished for not paying the wee tax case and going into admin. That was it. We, sorry Craig Whyte broke the league accountancy rules so they had the option to demote us. The other clubs voted for it.

When this civil case is over there is zero current recompense whereby the league can punish Celtic as the actual Club havnt broken the league rules. There were employees who have been paedos. The civil case won't hold Celtic criminally at fault and there is zero chance they will be kicked out the league. No teams would vote for that. Legally Celtic would blow that out the water.

That's how I see it. This is about Celtic paying the victims. With money. Not anything to do with the football results or honours.
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Punishment was orchestrated by people of a certain "persuasion" we know this to be true.

The many employees who've infiltrated the tax authorities in this country made damn sure our case was highlighted at the very top of tree. That's before you even mention media .

Also, the victims and their own individual perception of justice remains paramount with 99% of all rational human beings. That in no way obstructs those of us who demand repercussions with what comes next.
 
Bluethruandthru said:
Punishment was orchestrated by people of a certain "persuasion" we know this to be true.

The many employees who've infiltrated the tax authorities in this country made damn sure our case was highlighted at the very top of tree. That's before you even mention media .

Also, the victims and their own individual perception of justice remains paramount with 99% of all rational human beings. That in no way obstructs those of us who demand repercussions with what comes next.
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That's true however the people of certain persuasion won't be interested in going after Celtic
 
Kinghornloyal said:
We were punished for not paying the wee tax case and going into admin. That was it. We, sorry Craig Whyte broke the league accountancy rules so they had the option to demote us. The other clubs voted for it.

When this civil case is over there is zero current recompense whereby the league can punish Celtic as the actual Club havnt broken the league rules. There were employees who have been paedos. The civil case won't hold Celtic criminally at fault and there is zero chance they will be kicked out the league. No teams would vote for that. Legally Celtic would blow that out the water.

That's how I see it. This is about Celtic paying the victims. With money. Not anything to do with the football results or honours.
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Is it not within the league rules that you have to protect children in your care?

They made sure any perps were never reported to the police and also employed a few of them again at a later date.
 
GourockBlue50 said:
Is it not within the league rules that you have to protect children in your care?

They made sure any perps were never reported to the police and also employed a few of them again at a later date.
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How do you know for truth that the actual club knew. People involved in the club obviously did. There weren't the actual complaints to police etc like there have been.now. just saying the individuals who are guilty are individuals committing crimes.

As I said there will be zero important people at high levels interested in making sure the club are punished fir off field issues that has zero to do with the football side. That's my opinion.
 
One of the most prominant points to take from this 70 year on going nightmare is the fact that celtic as an organisation are being put above 100s of abused children. People in positions of power are actively valuing a football club as a higher priority than peoples lives. That is a fact. Otherwise this would of been dealt with decades ago. That is where the power lies for the likes of us, the outraged public, I couldn't possibly speak on behalf of the victims but the justice is in the lack of justice. Celtic will continue but WE ALL KNOW they are nothing more than an evil organisation. Their fans are just as bad as the club in terms of their deliberate silence.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
There will be nobody pushing the agenda to hammer Celtic. Will there
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Not from an rc persuasion as you've already indicated. That's akin to sacrilege.

That doesn't restrict anyone else who values common decency and justice from doing so or would you disagree.

The laws in this country were put in place for everyone. No person or institution should escape punishment. If there's an appetite for justice there anything can be achieved. c****c and their cohorts have already proven this. I almost admire their unity and certainly reuse to believe we're not capable of same.
 
Bluethruandthru said:
Not from an rc persuasion as you've already indicated. That's akin to sacrilege.

That doesn't restrict anyone else who values common decency and justice from doing so or would you disagree.

The laws in this country were put in place for everyone. No person or institution should escape punishment. If there's an appetite for justice there anything can be achieved. c****c and their cohorts have already proven this. I almost admire their unity and certainly reuse to believe we're not capable of same.
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Laws in this Country should be for everyone - but certain people put their own ‘side’ first - maybe drummed into them from a young age
 
Mostin said:
“It is not yet clear whether any settlement agreements will involve non-disclosure agreements.“

I thought I read on here that there can be no NDA’s involving criminal activity, have I picked that up wrong?
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Unless it's proven in court it's probably not criminal and can be hidden by an nda.
 
There are a few of the victims prepared / determined to have their day in Court . This is when the guilty verdict will come into effect. The bheasts will be frantically working on no victims going to court because they know the consequences it will have and is the reason they are eager to settle out of Court. If they are found guilty, which is a formality , then there is no reason to prevent further charges on celtc f.c. and the Directors at that time , of the crimes being committed., not sure if Lawwwell falls into that group as financial controller , The legal charges would only become possible after a guilty verdict. Also leaves the Scottish Football Governing Authorities nowhere to hide and should be forced to act..along with Swinney at Holyrood.who told us any further investigation was a waste of time and money, and not in the publics interest.
 
Kinghornloyal said:
OK mistake. The SFA had an investigation. The SNP have confirmed the government won't be holding an investigation into Scottish Football historical Abuse. I also can't see that changing even after the Celtic issue finishes.
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Labour might take different view than the snp should they get in
 
Timardim said:
There are a few of the victims prepared / determined to have their day in Court . This is when the guilty verdict will come into effect. The bheasts will be frantically working on no victims going to court because they know the consequences it will have and is the reason they are eager to settle out of Court. If they are found guilty, which is a formality , then there is no reason to prevent further charges on celtc f.c. and the Directors at that time , of the crimes being committed., not sure if Lawwwell falls into that group as financial controller , The legal charges would only become possible after a guilty verdict. Also leaves the Scottish Football Governing Authorities nowhere to hide and should be forced to act..along with Swinney at Holyrood.who told us any further investigation was a waste of time and money, and not in the publics interest.
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It won’t be going to court mate. I 100% guarantee you that
 
PaisleyBlueBear said:
Celtic haven’t admitted guilt
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That might be true in law but for most people it's obvious that they are not deciding to pay this compensation out of the goodness of their hearts.

They have obviously realised they were likely to be found guilty and then tried to short circuit the process by paying compensation.

For me it's an admission of guilt, although they should be forced to go further.
 
The pro's and con's of legal litigation, the fact remains nine convictions associated with the Celtic football club and the abuse of minors.
Correct me if I am wrong but multiple parties involved in the cover up and denials is hardly fit and proper personnel ,bringing the game into disrepute doesn't cover it.
The deception over decades, the deceitful denials, the fact no one in authority have taken this organisation to task speaks volumes for the integrity of the game in this country.
Absolutely no support, counciling or help for the victims?
Just a wall of abhorrent denials , typical cult behaviour.
 
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