Past And Future Of Our Support

A few recent posts and threads have got me thinking about our support: where we've come from and where we're going.

The Club was formed for the sheer love of football by passionate and ambitious young lads. We had no political or religious links (those came decades later, and admittedly, formed a large part of our identity throughout the 20th century), and simply wished to strive for footballing excellence in a fierce sporting rivalry with Celtic.

As a club in the 21st century, we've moved on. The world has moved on, and we now have a worldwide support from all walks of life.

If we want to stay true to our real roots, and grow as a global brand, shouldn't we focus more on the football and our founders, and separate ourselves as much as possible from this Old Firm nonsense?

IF Scotland does end up independent from the UK how would this change the Loyalist/Unionist aspects of our support? (Would it make us more inclined to express our Scottish identity, or would we look more outwardly?)

And finally, with so many kids from all over the world, including Scotland, being obsessed with the EPL, will this have an impact on our future support at home and abroad?
Will we still be selling 40-50 k season tickets generations from now?
Interesting post.

In terms of football, we can now see a clear difference in Scottish and English football due to finances.

If Scotland is ever stupid enough to vote for independence then the country and it's population will be significantly poorer than it is now. This will feed through to the incomes of the Scottish football clubs. The obvious outcome of clubs having less money is that players will be sourced from within the country. This would have a negative effect on the standard of our football, for a significant period of time and possibly permanently. Question then becomes whether people are still happy to watch a lower standard of product in as large numbers as currently. I suspect they would as long as it is competitive, however we would be unlikely to be able to compete in Europe when the domestic product has taken a large step down in standard. So it would be domestic interests only.
 
I have no interest really in religion even though i call my self a Protestant and my wife was raised catholic but also has no interest in religion. Our kids are Rangers daft and Danilo is their favourite.
Speaking to some other parents at the school gates and football training, they buy them Man City and Barcelona tops and they are from rangers supporting families. I asked one of the mums in a jokey way “ where’s the Rangers top” and she replied along the lines “ I think he prefers Barcelona and less religion involved” . Which shocked me.
We have to stop some parents seeing us a toxic as we will certainly lose some young fans who will be the next generation if they are pushed down the EPL route instead of Rangers .
You certainly do get people who have been 'conditioned' into an unrealistic negative view of Rangers.

You also however, get a more legitimate fear from parents that their kids are more likely to get hassled (even by adults) wearing the colours, which is unfortunately true.

It's understandable how some parents with no strong loyalty towards us would go for the easier option of Barca, Real Man U, etc. As we are all well aware of, Scottish football is as toxic as ever, possibly even more so the last 20 odd years.
 
Exactly. The 'you've failed as a parent ' posts always make me laugh a bit. Probably more often than not posted by someone that doesn't even have kids.

If your kid isn't interested in football then he's not interested. No amount of forcing is gonna change that. I'd argue that you're failing as a parent if you're trying to force your likes and hobbies onto a child that isn't interested.
I’d argue the important part of what I said was allowing them to support EPL teams over Rangers, if they support an English side they quite clearly like football.
 
I think the referendum and the continuing fight for independence has had an effect on the way we are perceived,Our club are squarely in the Scottish British unionist camp but we do have fans and people who might otherwise have been Rangers fans or at least sympathysers who don’t like it.
 
The Rangers support imo should continue to associate with a British unionist ideology and fan culture. This is a way of thinking that helps me continue to be attached to the club personally. If we don’t we have surrendered.
I think the club and fans can still have a majority unionist leanings, but I think the original post is referring to “F .ck the pope and Bobby sands “ stuff that will for sure ease away gradually as generations change
 
Not sure I agree really that the support is any danger of declining. In terms of match going fans in the modern era we have higher demand than ever despite high prices and quite a poor matchday experience at the moment.

In terms of becoming a more global brand the only way to do that is by regular runs in European competition. There is never going to be a market for people globally to watch domestic football just like how barely anyone in Scotland watches leagues outside the top 5 in Europe.

We showed only a few years ago that the myth that Scottish clubs cannot compete in Europe was untrue when we put out 2 of the top German teams on route to the final. That is how Rangers will stay relevant as a big club in the future, we have to be competitive in whatever European competition we are in.
 
The Rangers support imo should continue to associate with a British unionist ideology and fan culture. This is a way of thinking that helps me continue to be attached to the club personally. If we don’t we have surrendered.

Demographics are changing.

There will be a point in the near future where it will be difficult to know whether the Rangers support has a unionist ideology or whether it's a learned behaviour that people associate with supporting Rangers first and a wider political belief a distant second? It's the same thing that'll have with the protestant identity as fewer and fewer people have any kind of connection with religion.

At what point does is it tip over from fans driving those beliefs as an identity of the support or those beliefs becoming a sort of quick and easy identity that non-believers simply join in with because it has become a cliched expectation?

We're probably a generation or two away from it being entirely learned behaviour within the context of the football support rather than something that's an inherent part of a fan's identity that they bring with them as part of the support. And what happens then?
 
I've never identified with the protestant, loyalist identity at any point in my life, I don't sing the songs which are celebrating those things, but that certainly hasn't impacted my love for Rangers. I don't think I'm in a minority that way these days where I would have been in the past. There's many a fan of the club who sing songs at a game who aren't passionate about the song subject but about Rangers.

I can see the points being made by the OP, and there was a time I would have been fully on board, but I'm not sure we've ever had such a consistent run of ticket sales, support engagement (be that positive or negative) and passion from the stands in my lifetime as we do now, and all of that suggests we're not suffering due to the stuff mentioned.
 
Demographics are changing.

There will be a point in the near future where it will be difficult to know whether the Rangers support has a unionist ideology or whether it's a learned behaviour that people associate with supporting Rangers first and a wider political belief a distant second? It's the same thing that'll have with the protestant identity as fewer and fewer people have any kind of connection with religion.

At what point does is it tip over from fans driving those beliefs as an identity of the support or those beliefs becoming a sort of quick and easy identity that non-believers simply join in with because it has become a cliched expectation?

We're probably a generation or two away from it being entirely learned behaviour within the context of the football support rather than something that's an inherent part of a fan's identity that they bring with them as part of the support. And what happens then?

I think that already has tipped over, personally.

The 2022 census suggests that 51% of people in Scotland follow no religion at all. It's a massive difference from where those percentages were just over a decade earlier.

If that lot decided tomorrow to all identify as buddhist, the songs about the wee fat idol would be louder than those about the UVF or protestantism. It's more about hating that lot than anything else now.
 
That's fair enough, mate. I'm not knocking anyone's views on that, but don't you think that it's something that will hold us back in the next 40 years of rapidly changing football?
No , the players may change fans stay the same . And you know deep down the majority of fans still like the old traditional stuff , despite the woke brigade trying to change
 
No , the players may change fans stay the same . And you know deep down the majority of fans still like the old traditional stuff , despite the woke brigade trying to change
Thank goodness there is no woke brigade at Rangers , but I can see the point in this topic as I reckon as a support we will change from generation to generation no matter how much we like tradition.
 
I think that already has tipped over, personally.

The 2022 census suggests that 51% of people in Scotland follow no religion at all. It's a massive difference from where those percentages were just over a decade earlier.

If that lot decided tomorrow to all identify as buddhist, the songs about the wee fat idol would be louder than those about the UVF or protestantism. It's more about hating that lot than anything else now.
Best post I’ve read on here for a good while.
 
The loyalist songs are the loudest sung in the stadium. Says it all. Our Loyalist, Protestant and Unionist identity is going nowhere.
 
The loyalist songs are the loudest sung in the stadium. Says it all. Our Loyalist, Protestant and Unionist identity is going nowhere.
How many singing the songs are true Loyalists or Protestants though? And I include myself in that. I'm an atheist and haven't been in a church since primary school. I still sing the songs though cos that's just what you do
 
I saw a video the other day where a former Loyalist group member was talking about drinking in a Rangers pub the day Bobby Sands had died. It was on the news and some guy was taking the piss and slagging off Sands.

The Loyalist guy's mate (also a member of the UVF? UDA?) eventually swung round, basically told the guy that he was a c**t and that Sands was a soldier then knocked the guy out.
Be interested to know what pub this was, In Glasgow?
 
How many singing the songs are true Loyalists or Protestants though? And I include myself in that. I'm an atheist and haven't been in a church since primary school. I still sing the songs though cos that's just what you do
What do you mean by true loyalists though? Is everyone singing it taking up the gun? Of course not. But it does show that identity is ingrained in the fans.
 
I guess one for David Mason , at the start i wonder what the split was with. RCs and Prods in the team and when it eventually ended up more of a Protestant team.
Rangers played RC and CoS Players when we were formed, The local Priest was a Member until the RC Church told them not to play with us
 
The loyalist songs are the loudest sung in the stadium. Says it all. Our Loyalist, Protestant and Unionist identity is going nowhere.

I disagree that those are the ones sung the loudest.

Absolutely the most often, because the Union Bears lead the way there. But the song for Lundstram, the Abba stuff, the song for Butland - when those have been sung, they tend to have a lot more people joining in.
 
My lack of support for national team has nothing to do with independence and faux Scottishness. It's about the hatred Scottish fans have towards Rangers and Rangers players.
I can't align myself with them, ever.
You do realise this is vastly exaggerated. Almost to a point I wonder than some wish it to be true so that they can spend the day harrumphing !

Wanting Scotland to win doesn’t diminish my dislike of Celtic in any way. I just manage to park it while a few, and it is a few, fannies cant. That said, chanting against the Tartan Army isn’t going to mend any bridges is it!
 
I disagree that those are the ones sung the loudest.

Absolutely the most often, because the Union Bears lead the way there. But the song for Lundstram, the Abba stuff, the song for Butland - when those have been sung, they tend to have a lot more people joining in.
Build My Gallows and Derrys Walls are still the loudest IMO.
 
You do realise this is vastly exaggerated. Almost to a point I wonder than some wish it to be true so that they can spend the day harrumphing !

Wanting Scotland to win doesn’t diminish my dislike of Celtic in any way. I just manage to park it while a few, and it is a few, fannies cant. That said, chanting against the Tartan Army isn’t going to mend any bridges is it!
I'm sure the boos against Rangers players weren't exaggerated or the hatred the tartan army have for Rangers as a club.
Each to their own, if you can park it fair play, standing amongst those that revelled in our demise isn't for me. Building bridges? How's that going?
 
Football as we know it is on it's last legs. Club finances are unsustainable, even in big money leagues. The Saudis are preparing for life after oil and will almost certainly replicate :LIV with their own football tournament. Kids now grow up associating football with something they watch on TV or online rather than attending on a Saturday. They follow players in the same way folk followed teen idol bands/singers or actors.

We're approaching a point where the money clubs will go off and do their own thing and where everybody left will face a massive change. We're essentially going to see the game split in two - we'll have TV superstar football and we'll have real football.

How do we fit in with that? Right now we don't. Neither ourselves or the mhanks are a global elite club. Is there potential for us to be part of that group? I'm not sure. We'd need to be invited to a future super league and we'd need to be able to justify our inclusion from a financial viewpoint. Its a vicious circle - we're not currently a globally elite team because we don't play in a big league and don't have globally followed players and we won't have those unless we can play in a big league. And it's not enough to be part of that big league - at best there are only a handful of EPL clubs who'd be involved if a super league was established.

I think football needs a great reset. Let the superstar money clubs go off and form their own competition. Want to be the football equivalent of the NFL and owned/operated from the middle east? Wire in. Let those of us who are left go back to being football clubs. More modest wages. Stronger connection between fan and club. Proper football culture.

I think that the Germans have it pretty much spot on.
Couldn't agree more mate. Great post this and well put forward. I'll stick to the real football, thankyou. When I read the games rulers were now considering playing matches in other countries, that was enough for me. Maybe a trial in the next few years with the CL final in New York or LA.
 
I agree with the first bit. The second could be our downfall. Not because there’s anything wrong with it at all…but if it manifests only into shouting obscenities about the Pope, Bobby Sands and fynyns people will get bored with it.

Giving up a prominent part of the Scotland support and identity is also an act of surrender that we’ll rue one day. Look at the Northern Ireland support, great pride and fun in their part of the Union without griping the whole time that nearly half the country wishes for a different path.

I suspect other opinions will be available.
Them supporting NI isn't coming from the Falls Rd or the Bogside. It's part of their identity, which the 2 places I mention are trying to erase.
 
I'm sure the boos against Rangers players weren't exaggerated or the hatred the tartan army have for Rangers as a club.
Each to their own, if you can park it fair play, standing amongst those that revelled in our demise isn't for me. Building bridges? How's that going?
You talk as if the Tartan Army was a homogenous groupthink entirely free of Rangers fans. It isn’t. I’d venture most don’t give Club issues a second thought, probably as they’re there with a pal or two who are Rangers supporters.

Of course others revelled when Scotland’s dominant Club went down. I would too if it happened to Celtic. Goes with the territory of being number one in any country.

What probably does get the goat of some smaller club fans is hearing ‘stick your tartan army up your arse’ from our fans. Because they are probably stupid enough to think the Rangers support is homogenous and anti-Scottish! This then v us does us absolutely no favours. By all means have little interest in the national team because they are poor and led by a miserable git, but can we park the Scotland v Rangers notion once and for all. I love seeing our players, all ages, men and women, get picked for the national team. Something those players are very proud to do.
 
You talk as if the Tartan Army was a homogenous groupthink entirely free of Rangers fans. It isn’t. I’d venture most don’t give Club issues a second thought, probably as they’re there with a pal or two who are Rangers supporters.

Of course others revelled when Scotland’s dominant Club went down. I would too if it happened to Celtic. Goes with the territory of being number one in any country.

What probably does get the goat of some smaller club fans is hearing ‘stick your tartan army up your arse’ from our fans. Because they are probably stupid enough to think the Rangers support is homogenous and anti-Scottish! This then v us does us absolutely no favours. By all means have little interest in the national team because they are poor and led by a miserable git, but can we park the Scotland v Rangers notion once and for all. I love seeing our players, all ages, men and women, get picked for the national team. Something those players are very proud to do.
You are making a lot of assumptions with your argument with probably this and that.

My argument is based on fact, Rangers players booed by Scotland support.

OK for other to revell in our demise but we shouldn't be upset but it's OK for other fans to get upset when we sing and I have to say not a sing I've heard at Ibrox, stick your tartan army up your arse?

As I said each to their own.

If our players are proud to represent Scotland then fair play and good luck to them. However I don't need to actively support Scotland due to that, as I don't actively support any other national team that our players are picked for.

Personally I think international football is a pain in the arse.
 
Not biting to your strange posts.
Why is it strange that it's the Island of Ireland, Eire or Republic in The South and Ulster and Northern Ireland in the North the bit that confuses me is that part of the South is furthest North, I could never get my head around that at school
That's just Geography nothing else
 
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Not always the case.
My son isn't interested and I've had him at Ibrox for euro nights.

My daughter however loves The Rangers.
In the queue before the Aris game and there was a woman about my age with her dad ahead of us.

That's how I envisage my future.
I'm glad to hear about your daughter's passion for the club mate but that makes me sad to hear that your son's not interested.

Is he not interested in football generally or does he just prefer EPL / European clubs to Rangers?

If it's the latter, do you think our lack of success in the past 12 years has been a factor in his lack of interest?

That's something that worries me sometimes. It has been such tough going being a Rangers fan the last decade, you can see why some younger ones might not catch the bug the same as we did as kids. At least in the same kind of numbers.
 
My team are Rangers.
My religion is Rangers.
I couldn’t give a flying fu*k about any players religion or background. Plays for us and does his best he’s one of us.
Likewise any Bear growing up and going into play for that filth is a rhat cu*t and I wish them nothing but misfortune.
 
A few recent posts and threads have got me thinking about our support: where we've come from and where we're going.

The Club was formed for the sheer love of football by passionate and ambitious young lads. We had no political or religious links (those came decades later, and admittedly, formed a large part of our identity throughout the 20th century), and simply wished to strive for footballing excellence in a fierce sporting rivalry with Celtic.

As a club in the 21st century, we've moved on. The world has moved on, and we now have a worldwide support from all walks of life.

If we want to stay true to our real roots, and grow as a global brand, shouldn't we focus more on the football and our founders, and separate ourselves as much as possible from this Old Firm nonsense?

IF Scotland does end up independent from the UK how would this change the Loyalist/Unionist aspects of our support? (Would it make us more inclined to express our Scottish identity, or would we look more outwardly?)

And finally, with so many kids from all over the world, including Scotland, being obsessed with the EPL, will this have an impact on our future support at home and abroad?
Will we still be selling 40-50 k season tickets generations from now?
May I address your comments from someone who has been around and seen the changes from 60 years +.
Our club moved on essentially from when Souness was recruited 1986.
Pre that time we were an essentially an all Protestant club.
I remember season tickets torn up when we signed Maurice Johnston despite the paedos being apoplectic that a good RC who had played for them joined us.
He was met with great distrust by our support until he scored a last minute winner against them giving us a 1-0 victory.
How joyous it was revelling their abject misery.
I mention these things as a seismic moment in our history.
Even decades after that when RC’s played for us if they should cross themselves was met with derision and they were advised not to do so.

Rangers have evolved since those days on the playing side and in my view no longer does our support give a hoot whether a Rangers player crosses themselves or what religion they are and that’s how it should be.

As a boy when watching football there were chiefly two elements of football supporters which were us and them.
The Scottish National team support who attended games was made up of say roughly 60% minimum Rangers supporters.

This is now the next seismic event that has happened in my lifetime.
Where we now have 3 distinct categories of supporters in this country.
2 of whom despise us which is the paedos who have always despised us and now the rest of Scotland with the exception of Rangers supporters.
We are now the last bastions of unionism within Scotland.
Essentially that is our heritage.

We’ve always had a support from all walks of life and this is nothing new.
Imo we should not remove ourselves from the OF nonsense as let’s not kid ourselves as this is the only reason Sky is in any way interested in Scottish football.
We will never be a worldwide brand exacerbated by the tinpot league we play in .
We do have worldwide supporters which is a different matter.

We also should divorce ourselves from Nationalism which history is littered with reasons not to go down that route.
I remain proudly Scottish and British and they are not exclusive.
I hope our support will never change and the UB gives me hope we will continue with the traditions that make us as a club.
I am not ashamed of any of this nor do I see a reason why Rangers should not continue to flourish with 50k plus attendances.
Remember this is also a new phenomenon post Souness and prior to that very few only a few thousand ostensibly wealthier fans had season tickets.

We can never truly be a worldwide brand.
 
Be interested to know what pub this was, In Glasgow?
No it was the lower shankill , guy was called Billy Mcquiston aka twister UDA , he admired sands ( not my view ) . What’s not widely known is that loyalists also for a period went on the blanket protest , but backed down as outside support didn’t want to be associated with the Provo’s . Point is both were fighting a political war and as much as we hated them , both were political soldiers
 
we will need to move on from the loyalist & unionist imagery and songbook if we are to really maximise the potential of Rangers, it hampers us reaching a wider audience and blue chip companies will not be interested in sponsoring us

Looking at the Scottish census & changing demographics
You have an ageing white protestant & unionist population, not least in Glasgow & the Ibrox area itself, by focussing solely on football & with a nod to Scottish identity for ex-pats / yanks marketing, is the long term smart move
 
Some great feedback, folks. Brilliant hearing the views of Bears young and not so young.

Scottish football is a bizarre thing. On the one hand it's a farce that's dying a death - no champions from outside Glasgow in almost 40 years, and I don't see how that changes in the next 40 years. Empty stands and sweetie papers rustling when you watch Sportscene, but yeah, demand for Rangers tickets is probably the highest in our history.

I'm a bit of an over thinker, so I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what the future holds . . . While also being aware that we need to be proactive, and front and centre when it comes to changes.

When I said global brand, I was just using a term people are familiar with. I agree global brand and worldwide support are not the same things.
 
You do realise this is vastly exaggerated. Almost to a point I wonder than some wish it to be true so that they can spend the day harrumphing !

Wanting Scotland to win doesn’t diminish my dislike of Celtic in any way. I just manage to park it while a few, and it is a few, fannies cant. That said, chanting against the Tartan Army isn’t going to mend any bridges is it!

No, it isn’t.

What put me off going was hearing Rangers players being called ‘huns’ by the home crowd. ‘Lee Wallace is a grass’ banners being waved on the walk up Battlefield Road.Rangers players being booed.

it’s not a minority either.
 
Rangers played RC and CoS Players when we were formed, The local Priest was a Member until the RC Church told them not to play with us
Why would the church have told him not to play with us when we didn't have any religious or political affiliations until after 1912, mate?
And it was us who chose to go down the route of an exclusive policy.
 
No, it isn’t.

What put me off going was hearing Rangers players being called ‘huns’ by the home crowd. ‘Lee Wallace is a grass’ banners being waved on the walk up Battlefield Road.Rangers players being booed.

it’s not a minority either.
And Ryan Jack booed at every turn including when the team is announced. I think the vast majority of the Scotland support despise Rangers.
 
There is a saturation of football on TV just now
A super league will draw huge sponsorship and revenue with big viewing numbers ......until it become boring ...much as CL has become .....with only certain clubs able to win it
So other big clubs will want something different again........rinse and repeat
Stick true to our core values and no matter what.....we will still have our large support base.
Look at Germany. No matter what they don't all run to support a winning Munich team or EPL side. They stick with their club.
 
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