What happened to 'the cry was no surrender'?

S

SilvaBear

Well-Known Member
When did we become such an entitled support, that we throw the towel in when all's still to play for?

This is not directed at the traveling support, who are absolutely magnificent, loud and proud thru Sunday and yesterday's disasters. It's directed at the the doom and gloom merchants on here, and the 'fans' that leave Ibrox with the game on the line with 10-15 minutes to go, despite Phil's pleas to stay and support the team.

I was introduced to the Rangers by my old man in the 70s as a nipper. We were fairly shit at times, but it didn't and still doesn't matter, we're Rangers fans, we love our team, and we follow thru thick and thin. We support our team.

4 weeks ago, we were hailing PC as the second coming, now we have fans questioning his competence. It's fukin ridiculous considering the situation he inherited, and the injuries to our squad.

This may end up a disappointing season, OR, we could still win a treble.

The vast majority of loyal football fans would give everything to be in our position, so let's back PC and hold any post mortems if and when, the trophies are lost, not before.
 
Entitlement is not something I would accuse our support of. We have backed our club to the hilt through the leagues. Highest attendances in Scotland and the biggest travelling support in Scotland.

We have reached breaking point over the last few weeks due to the shitshow that is unfurling in front of our eyes. Im more angry with myself than the players. After years of watching them fold, I was genuinely sucked in with our form and results over the last few months. I put faith in the players and started to believe that we were going to drive on and reclaim our title. I now feel like a mug.

We get to the business end and the same leadership group shit the bed when silverware is in sight. Like many bears, it’s the final straw for me.

I will be at Hampden on Sunday following the team, however, I can’t wait until this squad is ripped apart and the old guard are thanked for their efforts and moved on. I wouldn’t lose sleep if most of the squad moved on.
 
I think the last 12 years have drained a lot of supporters of belief. I was arguing with others before the Dundee game to keep the faith and keep believing. It's hard to keep on like that when you can see players chucking it.
We're supporters, we're always going to care more than the vast majority of our players, staff and executives. Unfortunately its them that make or break seasons for us.
 
Ally’s Golden Boot said:
Entitlement is not something I would accuse our support of. We have backed our club to the hilt through the leagues. Highest attendances in Scotland and the biggest travelling support in Scotland.

We have reached breaking point over the last few weeks due to the shitshow that is unfurling in front of our eyes. Im more angry with myself than the players. After years of watching them fold, I was genuinely sucked in with our form and results over the last few months. I put faith in the players and started to believe that we were going to drive on and reclaim our title. I now feel like a mug.

We get to the business end and the same leadership group shit the bed when silverware is in sight. Like many bears, it’s the final straw for me.

I will be at Hampden on Sunday following the team, however, I can’t wait until this squad is ripped apart and the old guard are thanked for their efforts and moved on. I wouldn’t lose sleep if most of the squad moved on.
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I can understand the frustration, but we've not been deprived of excitement in recent years, the Euro performances have been the best in my lifetime, the journey to Seville the best performances I've seen, maybe Bobby Russell apart.

It's frustrating to lose to the filth, but let's face it, their recent trophies all have an * attached, and deep down, they know that WATP. I'm happy following the Gers, and will always laugh at the scum.
 
Willie Mac said:
I think the last 12 years have drained a lot of supporters of belief. I was arguing with others before the Dundee game to keep the faith and keep believing. It's hard to keep on like that when you can see players chucking it.
We're supporters, we're always going to care more than the vast majority of our players, staff and executives. Unfortunately its them that make or break seasons for us.
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Agreed, but we also need to retain some perspective.

As Rangers fans, we've seen our team win more trophies than any supporters in history, despite being utterly shafted by the governing bodies and member clubs since 2012.

We'll be back on top, this season, or next. I have no worries on that front.
 
SilvaBear said:
I can understand the frustration, but we've not been deprived of excitement in recent years, the Euro performances have been the best in my lifetime, the journey to Seville the best performances I've seen, maybe Bobby Russell apart.

It's frustrating to lose to the filth, but let's face it, their recent trophies all have an * attached, and deep down, they know that WATP. I'm happy following the Gers, and will always laugh at the scum.
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I’m with you. Our performances in Europe over the last 6 years have been the best and most consistent in my time following the bears since the early 80’s.

Seville run will live with me forever, This domestic season hurts though. Those scummy enablers were there for the taking. Our recent collapse is killing me. Go about our business in a competent manner, that creepy little plastic faced bastard would have already been chased out of the piggery. This one’s on the players.
 
Ally’s Golden Boot said:
I’m with you. Our performances in Europe over the last 6 years have been the best and most consistent in my time following the bears since the early 80’s.

Seville run will live with me forever, This domestic season hurts though. Those scummy enablers were there for the taking. Our recent collapse is killing me. Go about our business in a competent manner, that creepy little plastic faced bastard would have already been chased out of the piggery. This one’s on the players.
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I'll get shot down, but I don't think it's over, and whether it's this season or next, I'm backing big Phil to see that plasticine faced vagina out of town :)
 
It’s hard when the players are the ones waving the white flags. Getting beat is one thing but getting beat and not giving it 100% is unacceptable. I could see the point if the players were leaving everything on the pitch but they don’t seem to be. If they fight for it like it matters the fans would be right behind them
 
3 trophies in a decade and we still have season ticket waiting list of 10k+, every home game is packed, every away game is packed.

I don’t think anyone can get away with calling the support “entitled”, not when the same players have continuously let us down and ultimately got their gaffer the sack on multiple occasions. It’s not entitlement being pissed off at the fact we had the finish line in sight for the same group of let downs to f*ck it up once again.
 
Dean said:
It’s hard when the players are the ones waving the white flags. Getting beat is one thing but getting beat and not giving it 100% is unacceptable. I could see the point if the players were leaving everything on the pitch but they don’t seem to be. If they fight for it like it matters the fans would be right behind them
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I don't see guys not trying, I see a few players bereft of confidence.
It's weird, as we were full of it until the Motherwell defeat, a game we should have won.
Irrespective, we should stick with Phil whatever happens this season, he'll put us back on top.
 
I readily get where the OP is coming from. However, though the league is not lost, we look to be well into the process of losing it, with next to no evidence from recent games that we have the emotional drive, defensive strength, midfield creativity, or attacking prowess to arrest our slide. Our manager, for all the credit he deserves in hauling us back into title contention, is beginning to look bereft of the knowledge of what our problems are and the nous to - at least in the short term - solve them.

Right now, I'd settle for the Scottish Cup to add to the League Cup, though I'm no longer confident of beating Hearts on Sunday to get into the final - which will probably be against the Yahoos, who, frankly, have our measure, and would be expectant of another gift of a goal from us as has happened, maddeningly, in too many games against them in recent years.

That's not running a white flag up the pole; it's being realistic.
 
If we had won both games we'd be 2 points in front.
Given that everyone assumes us and them will win every game we still needed to draw at the paedophile harbour.
Now we need to win there.
That's it.
On red nerrus ya bass.
 
SilvaBear said:
Agreed, but we also need to retain some perspective.

As Rangers fans, we've seen our team win more trophies than any supporters in history, despite being utterly shafted by the governing bodies and member clubs since 2012.

We'll be back on top, this season, or next. I have no worries on that front.
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Perspective is based on experience. I experienced 9 in a row, missing 10, wining the next 2 then being in a title fight with them for the most part with McLeish and Walter coming back. from 2012 we've had some hard hard times. For supporters under 30 most of their time supporting us (at least actively) has been pretty bloody tough, at least in terms of honours. Their perspective isn't going to be the same as others who've lived through the success and dominant years. When they lose their shit who can blame them to be fair?
 
SilvaBear said:
When did we become such an entitled support, that we throw the towel in when all's still to play for?

This is not directed at the traveling support, who are absolutely magnificent, loud and proud thru Sunday and yesterday's disasters. It's directed at the the doom and gloom merchants on here, and the 'fans' that leave Ibrox with the game on the line with 10-15 minutes to go, despite Phil's pleas to stay and support the team.

I was introduced to the Rangers by my old man in the 70s as a nipper. We were fairly shit at times, but it didn't and still doesn't matter, we're Rangers fans, we love our team, and we follow thru thick and thin. We support our team.

4 weeks ago, we were hailing PC as the second coming, now we have fans questioning his competence. It's fukin ridiculous considering the situation he inherited, and the injuries to our squad.

This may end up a disappointing season, OR, we could still win a treble.

The vast majority of loyal football fans would give everything to be in our position, so let's back PC and hold any post mortems if and when, the trophies are lost, not before.
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I agree with a lot you say but I remember standing in the enclosure at Ibrox in a cold winter night with only 15.000 fans. Don't rewrite history the fans of today are every bit as good if not better than in the 70's-80's
 
Weekend drinking started a day early, as a fanbase do you think any other clubs fans would have shown such support 2012 on? that is your answer, 100% commitment right there.
The players are the ones in question atm, if they showed the same desire and energy as the fans this post would not have appeared.
 
Think it’s as simple as the fans seeing our players not tracking runners and being out worked by opposition players, not engaging in tackles etc.

A lot of fans will consider that as not holding up their side of the deal. Some will see that and show frustration at it and some will sit back in silent amazement and some will debate it on a team forum.

Ultimately, if the players cannot motivate themselves to do the basics better than their opponents domestically they simply will not be champions, and if they do the basics with intensity and desire they will be backed to the hilt in every stadium they go to.
 
There are posters on here who i believe either don't watch Rangers or don't really know much about football.
Bravado is fine but but doesn't compare to reality. Rangers have been abysmal and have absolutely blown it and there are problems beneath the surface.
Maybe im a doom and gloom merchant but i watch every Rangers game, im a realist and i can guarantee like a lot of other fans im hurting much more than the OP.
 
Entitlement? What a joke! We can all see what’s in front of our eyes, it’s not based on “faith” it’s based on evidence! We have all seen this movie before, we all let ourselves believe this season was different, Clement had sussed it with the core players in our squad as we’ve not taken it this far before, but the bottle crashed and Clement is scratching his head at why his team are not playing the way he asked or like they are fighting for a title, putting themselves on the line for every ball and scrapping for every point to get it over the line! Watching a bunch of players feel sorry for themselves and wanting pity as they shrink and throw in the towel, not fit for the Rangers shirt! They can %^*& off, I like many are sick of them! If Clement has ideas of winning titles and cups then he needs rid of the core leadership who fail to lead time and again or he will be getting sacked soon enough!
 
SilvaBear said:
When did we become such an entitled support, that we throw the towel in when all's still to play for?

This is not directed at the traveling support, who are absolutely magnificent, loud and proud thru Sunday and yesterday's disasters. It's directed at the the doom and gloom merchants on here, and the 'fans' that leave Ibrox with the game on the line with 10-15 minutes to go, despite Phil's pleas to stay and support the team.

I was introduced to the Rangers by my old man in the 70s as a nipper. We were fairly shit at times, but it didn't and still doesn't matter, we're Rangers fans, we love our team, and we follow thru thick and thin. We support our team.

4 weeks ago, we were hailing PC as the second coming, now we have fans questioning his competence. It's fukin ridiculous considering the situation he inherited, and the injuries to our squad.

This may end up a disappointing season, OR, we could still win a treble.

The vast majority of loyal football fans would give everything to be in our position, so let's back PC and hold any post mortems if and when, the trophies are lost, not before.
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Have you seen the team play at all in the last two months?
 
Its not about surrendering. I look at things realistically rather than with blue tinted specs on.

The league isn't over but it's only a matter of time until it is. All the evidence points to more dropped points and terrible performances.
 
SilvaBear said:
When did we become such an entitled support, that we throw the towel in when all's still to play for?

This is not directed at the traveling support, who are absolutely magnificent, loud and proud thru Sunday and yesterday's disasters. It's directed at the the doom and gloom merchants on here, and the 'fans' that leave Ibrox with the game on the line with 10-15 minutes to go, despite Phil's pleas to stay and support the team.

I was introduced to the Rangers by my old man in the 70s as a nipper. We were fairly shit at times, but it didn't and still doesn't matter, we're Rangers fans, we love our team, and we follow thru thick and thin. We support our team.

4 weeks ago, we were hailing PC as the second coming, now we have fans questioning his competence. It's fukin ridiculous considering the situation he inherited, and the injuries to our squad.

This may end up a disappointing season, OR, we could still win a treble.

The vast majority of loyal football fans would give everything to be in our position, so let's back PC and hold any post mortems if and when, the trophies are lost, not before.
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The cry was no defenders
 
Wouldn't say it's surrendering tbh.

We've been to hell and back since 2012 and have backed the team 110% the entire time. We've spent thousands upon thousands following them all over the place and we are starved of any real success - something we were very used to.

We're sick of being led down the garden path by a team that fills you with hope year after year then shite their drawers and bottle it continually. We are sick to fucking death of being let down by the same players and hearing the same sound bites every time "We'll learn from this" - No, you clearly fucking won't learn from it or you would have done so about 7 fucking years ago.

Our patience is at breaking point.
The club asks us to blindly pay out top tier money and gives us very little back in terms of success and joy.
 
Ah great another dig at the support for not having a “no surrender” attitude when it matters not a jot.

It’s the fûcking players and manager that are surrendering it all, not the support.

Whether a few of us are blind optimists or massive pessimists (or realists at this stage) does not fûcking matter.

The squad is full of incompetents and shitebags that are pissing the season away at a rate of knots. The manager isn’t without criticism either.
 
SilvaBear said:
When did we become such an entitled support, that we throw the towel in when all's still to play for?

This is not directed at the traveling support, who are absolutely magnificent, loud and proud thru Sunday and yesterday's disasters. It's directed at the the doom and gloom merchants on here, and the 'fans' that leave Ibrox with the game on the line with 10-15 minutes to go, despite Phil's pleas to stay and support the team.

I was introduced to the Rangers by my old man in the 70s as a nipper. We were fairly shit at times, but it didn't and still doesn't matter, we're Rangers fans, we love our team, and we follow thru thick and thin. We support our team.

4 weeks ago, we were hailing PC as the second coming, now we have fans questioning his competence. It's fukin ridiculous considering the situation he inherited, and the injuries to our squad.

This may end up a disappointing season, OR, we could still win a treble.

The vast majority of loyal football fans would give everything to be in our position, so let's back PC and hold any post mortems if and when, the trophies are lost, not before.
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“Entitled support”

Given what we’ve been through for over a decade that’s pretty offensive imo

I realise its probably not meant to be but id say for a club of our size and playing in effectively a 2 team league, at this stage we should be expecting more

if that makes us "entitled" so be it
 
The chants of %^*& you Celtic we are going to win the league although being enjoyable at the time were perhaps a little premature even if we had been 10 points in front. A lot fell into the hype that they were shite and we were going to win every game when it was evident that we had strung a few good results together but were still capable of shooting ourselves in the foot. Which we invariably did.

The players and the support fell into the trap that other teams in the league are just there to make up the numbers.
 
As soon as I seen the team sheet against Dundee I had giving up. Didn’t watch the game.

With the exception of the semi-final that’ll be my approach for the rest of the season. Tavernier and Goldson does not equate with a team that can win league titles. So yes I’ve giving up on them, same story with the same group of players season after season now.
 
TerryMunro said:
As soon as I seen the team sheet against Dundee I had giving up. Didn’t watch the game.

With the exception of the semi-final that’ll be my approach for the rest of the season. Tavernier and Goldson does not equate with a team that can win league titles. So yes I’ve giving up on them, same story with the same group of players season after season now.
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That sounds pathetic to be honest

A Rangers fan didn’t tune into a game whereby we would have went 1 point behind with 5 games to play because they didn’t like the team sheet?

Don’t bother with the semi final either then
 
scooter70 said:
That sounds pathetic to be honest

A Rangers fan didn’t tune into a game whereby we would have went 1 point behind with 5 games to play because they didn’t like the team sheet?

Don’t bother with the semi final either then
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The semi-final is a one off, even a Tavernier and Goldson hindered team might pull that off. As soon as I seen the team sheet, the performance was a giving. They might of sneaked a lucky deflected goal or a penalty for a one nil win but that was the best we could have hoped for against Dundee and the other teams in the remaining league games.
 
I totally agree with what you say,but with us now being 3 points behind and a game at the Piggery to come too doesn't give us much confidence in winning the league.
Our capitulations at the Piggery are embarrassing and a disgrace.
 
Despite getting beat by Motherwell, not turning up for first half against them, and losing to Ross County, the fans turned up in numbers at Dundee and supported the team during the game. Quite rightly at the end frustration was expressed.

The players let the fans down... not the other way around
 
We're absolutely not entitled. Entitled would be winning more than three trophies in 12 years. It would be winning 20 odd, like I'd imagine our rivals have in that time, and demanding 36.

We have high expectations, maybe too high at times, but that comes from the fact we somehow maintain a winning mentality. High expectations demand success, and they should, or we'd happily settle for the odd day out at Hampden like a Hearts or Hibs.

I'd love you to be right, and you are in that there's technically, "all to play for." However, I'm 99% certain this season will fizzle out with a League Cup to show for it. The evidence of previous seasons shows that's what this core group of players produce when the going gets tough.

I still love Phil too. But, he is making mistakes right now that worry me. Picking strange line ups and making frankly bizarre comments in post match interviews about, "getting a reaction." I know he has to talk the players up, but you can do so in a way that's not blatant lies to anyone with eyes. I'm hoping he's backed into a corner with what he's saying at the moment as he still needs to get something from these players, but if he truly believes what he's saying publicly at present, I'm worried. Like I say though, I'm fairly confident he knows it's the end of the road for this group and just can't tell the press that.

This summer is huge and unfortunately that's again because the board backed the wrong guy by giving Beale millions last year, and to an extent not buying a striker in January. I'm hoping there's similar backing this summer because this level of mess takes a few transfer windows to sort out. It needs to start in earnest in June.
 
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Loyalty is a 2 way street

We have a board who treat supporters with contempt and for whom money is the main driver

They don’t hesitate to shaft loyal fans if there is a few quid in it

You can’t buy loyalty you have to earn it
 
The players surrendered to the mighty Ross County & Dundee when we were closing in on a title. There's no point in singing about not surrendering when that's exactly what this team do, time and again.
 
SilvaBear said:
I can understand the frustration, but we've not been deprived of excitement in recent years, the Euro performances have been the best in my lifetime, the journey to Seville the best performances I've seen, maybe Bobby Russell apart.

It's frustrating to lose to the filth, but let's face it, their recent trophies all have an * attached, and deep down, they know that WATP. I'm happy following the Gers, and will always laugh at the scum.
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“deep down they know that WATP” - just another comfort blanket soundbite I’m afraid. The tims will not give one flying fcuk that WATP when they watch their team pick up yet another league title. The performances at Ross County and Dundee were disgraceful and all Rangers supporters, whether they were at these games or not, are allowed to express their feelings about it and it’s not entitlement. As David mentioned on Heart & Hand, if you had no clue about Scottish football and watched the game against Dundee, you wouldn’t have known which team was going for a league title. That’s how bad we were. These players take wearing our shirt for granted and don’t deserve the support.
 
If only the players had the same passion as the fans.
It's nothing to do with 'entitled' fans but more to do with the same group of players being paid a fortune to crumble time and time again.
Surely there comes a point when it's clear something needs to be done to finally sort out the mess we've found ourselves in over the last few years.
I say that though as someone who won't give up on it until it's mathematically impossible. The problem is the players clearly have.
 
JW1988 said:
I'm guessing "leadership group" is the new FF "wage thief" that I can add to FF bingo?
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“By just being honest,” Wright said when asked how Rangers have maintained their belief despite some difficult moments this season. “Within in the changing room we’ve got a leadership group and the boss has obviously spoken in a few meetings.

That was under the GVB management debacle. This leadership group cost him his job by allowing it, the following manager had the same outcome. Let’s hope it doesn’t succumb another manager.
 
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