Do Some Fans Expect Us To Be Challenging?

Boogie Man said:
Mez did this last year with MW and is doing it again with Pedro.
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What, supported the manager? How dare I!

The idea that that’s a bad thing in the eyes of some people shows how fucking ridiculous this place is.
 
Mr. Blue said:
Do we really? With where we've been and what we have been through do we really expect to be challenging?
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I expect to be beating Partick Thistle. I expect when we go 1 up against them, to then finish them off. I expect to win more than 3 out of 6 given the fixtures we've had to start the season.
 
Mez said:
What, supported the manager? How dare I!

The idea that that’s a bad thing in the eyes of some people shows how fucking ridiculous this place is.
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No-one said it was a bad idea or that it was wrong. Telling people who disagree that they want Rangers to lose is.
 
Kilwinnin Bluenose said:
No-one said it was a bad idea or that it was wrong. Telling people who disagree that they want Rangers to lose is.
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So where have all the folk been that have come out the woodwork in the last 12 hours? No sign of them when we’re playing good football and getting good results, but as soon as we drop points they re-emerge to tell us all they knew we were shite all along.

It’s not a case of disagreeing. It’s actual gloating and it’s an embarrassment.
 
Mez said:
So where have all the folk been that have come out the woodwork in the last 12 hours? No sign of them when we’re playing good football and getting good results, but as soon as we drop points they re-emerge to tell us all they knew we were shite all along.

It’s not a case of disagreeing. It’s actual gloating and it’s an embarrassment.
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It's difficult to criticise after a good result as you just get accused of being negative (although I accept I am being negative at the moment). I might not have posted much but I've been on Caixinha's case since the Progres disaster and would have sacked him after that. Our start to the season has only strengthened my opinion he has to go.

If you were to see my reaction after a bad result you'll know it's certainly not gloating! I'm infamous for my post match pub rants!
 
Not changing Celtic but should be clear 2nd

Our resources massively out weight Aberdeen, but McInnes is canny and has recruited well for the needs of the SPL

We've lost the plot with the love in for Pedro. Seems a good honest guy but def not going to work out long term as a success in my view - strange appointment really.
 
Mr. Blue said:
Do we really? With where we've been and what we have been through do we really expect to be challenging?
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The least we can expect is to beat the bottom of the league teams who have ten men and i always expect us to challenge for the League.
I'm sure everyone wants Pedro to succeed as if he does we do but he looks lost at times.
 
I don't expect us to challenge. I still expect us to beat teams like Partick Thistle.
 
We shouldn't be heading five points behind the bheggars after 6 games played.

We should be capable of going to places like Fir Hill and beating a ridiculously poor opposition.

Played 6, won 3, drawn 2, lost 1. That's a terrible start given the opposition we've played.
 
Do I expect Rangers to be challenging for the title?

At the end of the season probably not at this stage, but if we lose next week the season is over in a matter of weeks for the second season running.

That is completely unacceptable for this football club.
 
I think the important thing is Dave King expected us to challenge this year given the outlay
 
I don't expect us to win the league, second place will be beyond us if we play like that. I do expect us to defend better than we did last night or it's going to be curtains for any hopes we might have.
 
DancinHomer said:
This forum is influenced almost completely by the most recent result. We beat bottom of the league and all of a sudden the tims are shitting it pedro is the man we are going to win the lot. Drop points and its Pedro out time again .

The truth of it all lies somewhere in the middle. We are improved under Pedro and the squad is better. We are still nowhere near challenging. Second place should be the aim and to get within 12 points of the scum.
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Agree completely with this.

There is not a chance that we will win the title, in my own modest and humble opinion. I'd love to be wrong, but I genuinely believe I wont be, sadly.

As you say, reducing that disgraceful 39 point gaps between us and the filth to a more creditable level is the best we can hope for. 12 points is probably a realistic target to aim for. That's not defeatest, that's realism.

Another cup final place along the way (ideally a win) would be another indication of progress. Regularly appearing in finals is also important.
 
I expected to challenge for a bit until maybe they were out if Europe but we can't even beat the rest ffs.

Hibs just up agreed a terrible ref.

Hearts were awful a team with no confidence and no manager we didn't look close to beating them now Thistle who haven't won a game all season and would probably have won if it was 11 vs 11.

I expected more of a challenge than we are putting up currently.
 
Jacrispy said:
One thing I've noticed since we got back in the SPL, what fans say they expect and what they actually expect are not the same thing.

They say they don't expect us to challenge them, but reactions to results showed even last season, plenty of those same folks blatantly did expect us to challenge
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This is very true, points will be dropped from time to time. We have improved from the warburton time and will contest with dolly for 2nd this season. I'm sure we will be able to give the unwashed a challenge next season with the same improvement.
 
Do I expect to be challenging? No

Do I expect us to be better? Absolutely

The investment we have made should see us stroll to second place, which we may still do of course. But I see nothing in this current set up that suggests we can put together 4 wins, like even Aberdeen have already done this season. We are miles off where we need to be.
 
im in the minorty here i think.

the mentally challengeds have a very good team domestically and an average one in europe and a very good manager.

they got thumped of PSG and Barcelona and we are using that as a method of measuring egonism of the manager and lack of quality in their squad....this approach is hurting us.

I dont really count red Imps as a way of measuring how good/bad they are as it was Brendas first game, our problem is that some fans cream themselves over that result as if we are not far behind because of it. i in return give Pedro the same treatment in that regard and dont measure his managing ability on it as it was early in season with a new team.

mentally challengeds have drawn away - Man City, B M'Gladbach, Astana
mentally challengeds hae drawn home - Man City
mentally challengeds have beaten away - Linfield. Rosenborg (who then dumped ajax out of the EL)
mentally challengeds have beaten home - Bersheeva, Astana x 2, Linfield
mentally challengeds have lost away - Barcelona, Astana (2017), Beersheeva
mentally challengeds have lost home - Barcelona, PSG, B M'Gladbach

16 games - 4xdraw , 6xwin , 6xlost

their record in europe is not as bad as people portray, yes barca and psg embarrassed them but both these teams embarrassed each other last season.

until we understand the actual capabilitities of our closet rivals and their manager then we can never fully measure our own expectations and this in turn will hurt us every time we do not win.

We needed to recruit well, very well actually and i dont feel we have done that, morelos is a great signing but i think he was JJ's and not the managers. signing morelos and jack in addition to walker, mclean, boyce, 2 full backs and a decent british Cb and keeping mckay in addition to getting mcinnes in would have given us a far better platfrom to win the league or at least be consistant in a challenge to the mentally challengeds.

Candeis, Dorrans, Alves, Herrerra will all be over 30 next year, pena is a disaster signing. thats approx 6 million in fees and about 100k per week in wages and these guys wont do anything remarkable this season.

call me what you want , but its an honest assessment. we are clutching at straws by measruing our success this season on the mentally challengeds results in europe. they are fucking 54 ish unbeaten in domestic game. it will be highly difficult to get close to them. i admire king for spending his cash but he needs better football brains around the club that would have helped him spent it.
 
My expectations this year were for us to perform better than last year and to show fight against them and not roll over and get obliterated...think most people would be the same.
 
I think we should be challenging to be honest. Surely, some of you on here have actually played football. How many times have you lost games against rubbish teams who are clearly not nearly as good as you? I've played in the best teams in leagues and you know what? We didn't lose to teams who weren't better than us. We lost in the big games when the opposition were just too strong but we had the right attitude and didn't lose these games. I've done this in 5 different teams. What is so hard about winning against a lesser opponent. I like Pedro and want him to succeed but it is getting ridiculously frustrating watching our team look like they might just be able to turn a corner and f*ck it up with an abject performance. It's gotten to the stage where the feeling of excitement when we start looking good is tempered, not by the fact that we know we are going to come up against stronger opponents, but the fact that if a team on a poor run of form comes up against us, they will undoubtedly take something from the game. We are not losing this league. We are throwing it away. That's what is most frustrating about it. I had hoped this season that we would at least put pressure on Celtic and make them have to earn the league this year and also see if they may actually struggle with a new dimension of having to fear the team behind them. This is a challenge they haven't faced yet and if I'm honest I was hoping it might just be the thing that we would have in our favour.

My only hope is that this team will settle in time. In the past many rangers teams have had to go through these hardships as they try to figure out a way to become consistent, and there are many different problems that they have to overcome. Eg. breaking down the stubborn defensive team, beating teams playing like a cup final, keeping concentration for 90 minutes. I really, really hope we can overcome this as I'm so tired of false dawns and am probably also a bad loser.
 
Yes, they do, and I'm not going to criticise them for that. I'll never criticise someone for wanting the best for our club.

However, the complete overreaction that happens after every dropped point is ridiculous. The manager and every player gets it in the neck, most of it very harsh and unfair.

We just aren't getting the breaks we deserve at the moment. I know people will argue with me and say results aren't good enough (which they aren't) but our performances so far have deserved more.

Whether it be poor refereeing (every game), missing chances at crucial times or deflected shots going into our own net, everything is going against us and these things IMO will start going for us if we have patience.

We look a far better team than last year. Yes there are still some problems but they are workable and fixable. I feel like we've dominated the vast majority of every game we've played this season and have only really looked under pressure for small periods.
 
We will not be challanging Celtic at all in the near future whilst they are playing so well.

SPL winners usually drop points in 20-30% of their games. The average champions points total is roughly 90 points out of a total of 114 available. Last year Celtic achieved 106 points, that is exceptional and it is not feasible that we will reach anywhere near that.

For me, this year is all about consolidating, getting a firm grip on what is required to compete. Rangers finished third last year with 67 points. The absolute minimum for me is to finish second, and show a big improvement in the points total.

We are no where near ready to compete with Celtic, sorry if it sounds defeatist, but its the harsh truth.
 
Expectation is a funny thing. Given the mess Rangers have been in for the past 7 or 8 years (including the end of the Murray era) it's arguable that fans can have very little expectation right now as to where Rangers should be.

That said, 2 draws and a loss in the first 6 league games isnt great. Particularly when that doesnt include games against Celtic or Aberdeen and does include a Hearts team that was in disarray and newly promoted Hibs.

Should fans expect to have done better from the first 6 games of the season? Look at the remaining 5 games of the first round of league fixtures and you'd expect wins against Hamilton and Kilmarnock, but you'd probably have expected wins against Thistle, Hibs and Hearts. The games against Celtic and Aberdeen were always going to be difficult and there's no doubt that St Johnstone will be a tough match. It's not beyond possibility that after 11 league games the record will be played 11, won 5, drawn 4, lost 2. It's also not beyond possibility that the record will be played 11, won 5, drawn 3, lost 3 - or worse.

How long does Pedro get to try and get things right? The European result was entirely unacceptable. He didnt exactly set the world alight after his appointment but most sensible observers would afford him at least a transfer window to assemble his own squad. He's done that, spending considerably more than any team other than Celtic, and the results are questionable.

Rangers need to rebuild gradually. The only way the club can hope to become consistent challengers is by improving bit by bit every season, hoping that we can bring in some good young players who will grow into being a very good core of a solid squad and supplement them with a handful of signings. That takes time. If it means cutting the gap every year, improved European performances every year and slowly, but sustainably, becoming genuine title contenders in a way that doesn't see a return to big spending, boom and bust management of the club then that's what has to happen. Fans need to be reasonable in what demands and expectations are made of the club.

But Pedro has undoubtedly had a mixed performance as Rangers manager so far. Fans should expect better than Pedro's Rangers are currently delivering. Expecting to get beyond Luxembourg opponents at the first hurdle of Europa League competition isnt an unrealistic expectation. Not losing against Hibs or drawing with Jon Daly's Hearts or a thistle team that had a record of 4 losses and a draw going into last night's game isnt an unrealistic expectation.

The board may face a difficult decision on the manager's future sooner rather than later. I'd be very surprised if they weren't asking the question no later than guy fawkes night.
 
I expect us to challenge them given how much we've spent. We've got the players to challenge them but we need the right manager in place and I'm still not sure Pedro's the guy.

When I say challenge, I mean at least stay in it 'til the split or so, I wouldn't expect us to win the league this season at all.

That said, Pedro has brought Alves, Cardoso, Candieas and Morelos in who most likely wouldn't be here if Pedro wasn't our manager.
 
Started the season looking to get a comfortable 2nd and get closer to the fhilth maybe a single figure gap,Its still early days but the signs are a wee bit worrying the players haven't came to terms with the fact every team lifts their game to cup final level v Rangers and we need to respond to the challenge.
 
MisterJay said:
I expect us to challenge them given how much we've spent. We've got the players to challenge them but we need the right manager in place and I'm still not sure Pedro's the guy.

When I say challenge, I mean at least stay in it 'til the split or so, I wouldn't expect us to win the league this season at all.

That said, Pedro has brought Alves, Cardoso, Candieas and Morelos in who most likely wouldn't be here if Pedro wasn't our manager.
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this is my point exactly. we have a team that in theory should finish second easily, but we also had the same tools last season and we didnt acieve it.

we will not challenge the mentally challengeds with this team. we are a 1 man team and that is morelos. take his goals out of it and its frightnig the position we owuld be in
 
lcpl_1st_bt_1872 said:
Yes i did but sadly now im coming to terms with what we have become now, a top 6 team. We wont ever be more without serious serious investment.
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Honestly, some of the shite written on here after we drop points is just ridiculous.

A top 6 team? What is that based on exactly?

Place full of drama queens!
 
Mr. Blue said:
Do we really? With where we've been and what we have been through do we really expect to be challenging?
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I'm not going to read the whole thread but, I'll bet you that anybody who says they wouldn't or don't, would still expect us to beat Patrick Thistle.
 
tazzabear said:
I'm not going to read the whole thread but, I'll bet you that anybody who says they wouldn't or don't, would still expect us to beat Patrick Thistle.
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Yep.

We've conceded in every league game so far apart from the draw with Hearts. Warburton got hounded for it. We need to be much tighter at the back.

Edit: It's pretty obvious we're going to concede in almost every game under Pedro until we play Jack and Rossiter together with Dorrans ahead of them. It has to be that 3.

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Mr. Blue said:
Do we really? With where we've been and what we have been through do we really expect to be challenging?
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Given our opening fixtures this season, we should have taken maximum points from all, except perhaps with the exception of the Hibs game, which was ruined as a contest when Jack was sent off.

The other games in which we've dropped points were Hearts at home (should have won) and Partick away last night (1-0 up at half time, should have won).

Even allowing for the Hibs defeat, we should currently be top of the league on 15 points.

So yes, we should be challenging.

As for the derby next weekend - well, these can frequently go against form. With home advantage, who knows?

Had we applied ourselves more, then worst case scenario we could have won next weekend and be 2 points clear with no one having games in hand on us.

We will most likely be 5 points off the pace by teatime tonight with an inferior goal difference. But if we could pull off a result next weekend then it's very much game on. We just need to work harder and have more confidence.
 
Challenging Aberdeen and St.Johnstone yeah.

The only clowns I've read predicting that we would win the league or challenge Celtic are the ones who relentlessly cheerlead for Pedro.
 
DancinHomer said:
This forum is influenced almost completely by the most recent result. We beat bottom of the league and all of a sudden the tims are shitting it pedro is the man we are going to win the lot. Drop points and its Pedro out time again .

The truth of it all lies somewhere in the middle. We are improved under Pedro and the squad is better. We are still nowhere near challenging. Second place should be the aim and to get within 12 points of the scum.
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Well we're going to be 8 behind by next Saturday be lucky to be within 15
 
I believe that a manager should be given 15-20 games 25 games at max be it friendlies, competitive and then judge him as see what his win rate is to decide if he stays or goes. The managers methodology has to show on the park with a couple of blips due to being unlucky or crap ref decisions cost us.

The question should be how much time does a manager get. In my view its best to get them out sooner rather than later as a new manager coming in can change it quickly and get our season back on track before its too LATE.

If we wait and give pedro more time till Christmas the league is well and truly over. If we change after next Saturday it will give the new manager an opportunity to win the title with the new system plus get ready for next season also giving him the January transfer window to buy his own players.

If warburton got terminated earlier before the January transfer window and bought in all the players in January 2017 we may still have been in europe and top of the spl.

Rangers are not just a big club, but are world class prestige club who have won more silverware than any other club not in the UK or Europe but the globe remember that everyone thinks its Man Utd or Real Madrid no its Rangers that's how big a club we are with about 7-8 million fans worldwide approx with 468 supporter groups worldwide compare that to any team and see the difference how big we are.
 
I expect us to be above Aberdeen. If we lose next weekend we could potentially be in the bottom six.
That would be unacceptable.
 
Copland Rear 1872 said:
Well we're going to be 8 behind by next Saturday be lucky to be within 15
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Let's just see how the tims do in their next 2 games before we call it game over already. We might not be great just now but neither are they, they're having just a bad a month as us so far.

I expect them to beat Ross County today but it doesn't take away from the fact they're not high in confidence themselves at the moment.
 
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I actually deep down didn't think we would challenge the scavengers over at the girodome,but given what we have spent and our wages and player recruitment ,we should be all over the sheep for 2nd place and knocking points of the scum overall.
 
TARBERT LOYAL said:
we have no god giving right to finish 2nd. we have to earn 2nd or 3rd etc finish the same as a cup final you have to earn it. but some fans think we should have finish 1st last season.
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We don't have a right to it no, we do have a right to question why our manager has achieved less points or equal to three other teams whilst spending vastly more cash than two of them.

There's every chance we could be fifth by close of play this weekend.
 
If only football was played on paper...

I still can't believe that after 5+ years it still hasn't sunk in that we can't just expect to turn up and beat teams anymore.


Quijibo said:
We don't have a right to it no, we do have a right to question why our manager has achieved less points or equal to three other teams whilst spending vastly more cash than two of them.

There's every chance we could be fifth by close of play this weekend.
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Just as well the trophies aren't handed out at the end of September then eh?
 
SevenTrebles said:
I believe that a manager should be given 15-20 games 25 games at max be it friendlies, competitive and then judge him as see what his win rate is to decide if he stays or goes. The managers methodology has to show on the park with a couple of blips due to being unlucky or crap ref decisions cost us.

The question should be how much time does a manager get. In my view its best to get them out sooner rather than later as a new manager coming in can change it quickly and get our season back on track before its too LATE.

If we wait and give pedro more time till Christmas the league is well and truly over. If we change after next Saturday it will give the new manager an opportunity to win the title with the new system plus get ready for next season also giving him the January transfer window to buy his own players.

If warburton got terminated earlier before the January transfer window and bought in all the players in January 2017 we may still have been in europe and top of the spl.

Rangers are not just a big club, but are world class prestige club who have won more silverware than any other club not in the UK or Europe but the globe remember that everyone thinks its Man Utd or Real Madrid no its Rangers that's how big a club we are with about 7-8 million fans worldwide approx with 468 supporter groups worldwide compare that to any team and see the difference how big we are.
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I'd have agreed with your first paragraph but Progres not the stuffing out of me.
After that, I said he should have maximum points going into the septic game but we've dropped seven.
I don't know how many more "tests" I can allow him.
This is despite a general feeling of liking the guy and accepting that he can't be blamed (still responsible for though, if you understand my differentiating of the two) for the three, four, five, six individual errors that caused us the goals last night.
Also, the almost every game refereeing debacle which I also put in his "for" column.
The "against" column though, is getting bigger.
Major negatives from the lack of return from Pena and Herrera, Cardoso looking weak in the air, not replacing McKay and his perseverance with Miller all stack up.
 
To be out of it again by the end of September is simply unacceptable, should that end up being the case. My standards have lowered enough already. No further
 
I found it bizarre, but not particularly surprising, that simply by virtue of beating Ross County and Dundee some were beginning to talk about us winning the title.

Two dropped points later, the sobering reality hits home once again.
 
A defeat next week leaves us 8 behind the bheggars and out the title race at virtually the same point as last season.

Improvement... ?
 
We have won the league before with 9 points behind them with 5 games to go. I wouldn't write the league off end of September or 8 points if they are 15+ points ahead by end of January/Feb next year it's gone so best thing to do is replace the manager asap before more damage is done and he can bring in reinforcements in January as well as have a couple of months to adjust the new style, or we can say okay league is gone go for 2nd and try and win 2 cups with pedro.

Remember, PC failed to get 2nd last season his target!

June was very positive month for the club and after what I witnessed we should be top again within the next 2-3 years for sure.
 
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